#BoycottBeyonce

[Gwazi Magnum]

You guys realize you're using the exact same argument about two opposite sides? Something doesn't add up there.

It's shocking how often just a lack of communication can be the cause of conflict.

 

[Kooriryu]

 

[Gwazi Magnum]

I DON'T KNOW HOW!!!

BEWARE THE:

WORD, DOUBLE QUOTE, QUOTE, EQUAL SIGN, QUOTE!!!

 

[SacredWarrior]

@Hellis @SacredWarrior

You guys realize you're using the exact same argument about two opposite sides? Something doesn't add up there.

My point exactly. If an argument can be used against BOTH sides, it shouldn't be used in the first place because it cancels itself out. Which is why advocating for social justice isn't getting shit done and making shit worse. Because when you flip their logic around, you're called racist and sexist for it.

 

[Astaroth]

@SacredWarrior

Except "advocating for social justice" literally means advocating for improvement of society via implementing change to more effectively grant equal rights for all people.

There's a difference between advocating for social justice and being one of those people who sits on Tumblr and Twitter all day harassing people for not having the same beliefs they do.


I also wanted to reply to your bit about how BLM shouldn't be free from criticism. I agree. No one is free from criticism. For example, the second video you linked where the guy is pointing out how their tactics are hurting regular citizens more than the government? That's an excellent point that should be discussed, and they should hear that criticism.

 

[SacredWarrior]

@SacredWarrior

Except "advocating for social justice" literally means advocating for improvement of society via implementing change to more effectively grant equal rights for all people.

There's a difference between advocating for social justice and being one of those people who sits on Tumblr and Twitter all day harassing people for not having the same beliefs they do.


I also wanted to reply to your bit about how BLM shouldn't be free from criticism. I agree. No one is free from criticism. For example, the second video you linked where the guy is pointing out how their tactics are hurting regular citizens more than the government? That's an excellent point that should be discussed, and they should hear that criticism.

Is that why "safe spaces" exist? Is that why whenever there's a conference about male rights or when a domestic violence shelter for men is about to be made, feminists shut it down?

There is NO difference because they act the same. How?

By wanting to police our speech and police how we approach and treat people based on their race and gender. There's a reason why people like Anita Sarkessian and Zoey Quinn were allowed to speak to the UN about censoring the internet and don't get me started on what's gonna happen to Twitter. Hell we have things like affirmative action and scholarships for people based SOLELY on their race.

If that's advocating for social justice, then it's bullshit because those people you talk about on Tumblr and Twitter are the ones getting ALL the power and THEY'RE being listened to. Not me. Not you. THEM. And we can't say anything or else our lives will be forever ruined.

Which brings me back to the No True Scotsman Fallacy point. An advocate gets shit done and brings about change. And these people are bringing about change to the point where it's running rampant in our colleges. They ARE real advocates. Not you. Not me. THEM. THAT is why the NTS fallacy is just that. A fallacy.


They're not going to hear it because they think they're God's gift to humanity. Also BLM is VERY disorganized and that is one of the WORST things about them. They don't even have a leader! That Guy T pretty much stated why I don't care for BLM and never will in the two videos I shared.

 

[Gwazi Magnum]

There's a reason why people like Anita Sarkessian and Zoey Quinn were allowed to speak to the UN about censoring the internet and don't get me started on what's gonna happen to Twitter.

About that.

It kind of blew up in their faces.

 

[Astaroth]

@SacredWarrior

Except I'm not trying to say anyone is less "real" than anyone else. I am saying that I and others like me should not be judged by the actions of people who do not believe or do the same things I do. How is that a fallacy?

Also, sorry, I'm not going to shut up just because some people don't like what I have to say or because other people are louder and more obnoxious than I am. That's stupid and counterproductive.

 

[SacredWarrior]

@SacredWarrior

Except I'm not trying to say anyone is less "real" than anyone else. I am saying that I and others like me should not be judged by the actions of people who do not believe or do the same things I do. How is that a fallacy?

Also, sorry, I'm not going to shut up just because some people don't like what I have to say or because other people are louder and more obnoxious than I am. That's stupid and counterproductive.

It's not a fallacy. Individualism is never a fallacy. It's only a fallacy if you take it too far which is what people have been doing lately by demanding that minorities and women be free from criticism.

And the same could apply to people like me. Remember if your argument can be flipped around, it's not a good one. I said that if you can't handle people having different thoughts than you and countering you with them, that you should be silent. There's a difference.

 

[SacredWarrior]

About that.

It kind of blew up in their faces.

Good to know but my point about power still stands because they actually got that far.

 

[Astaroth]

@SacredWarrior

I'm perfectly fine with people having different viewpoints than me. What I'm addressing is how, several times throughout this conversation, you've expressed that people shouldn't call themselves x thing or how there's no point in saying y because these other people are doing/saying z and won't let you have your say.

 

[SacredWarrior]

@SacredWarrior

I'm perfectly fine with people having different viewpoints than me. What I'm addressing is how, several times throughout this conversation, you've expressed that people shouldn't call themselves x thing or how there's no point in saying y because these other people are doing/saying z and won't let you have your say.

Because social justice is starting to become totalitarianism. If you don't agree with what they say 100% or make choices that benefit them, well you know the rest. They want only their views to be heard and no one else's even if you identify with them in some way. That is what I mean and why I'm against feminism and the majority of social justice I see now.

 

[Astaroth]

@SacredWarrior

So basically, the difference between you and me is that I don't compromise my beliefs due to the demands of terrorists.

Jk.

But seriously, I don't see why I should stop calling myself a thing just because I don't fit someone else's definition of that thing or because a handful of other people who call themselves that thing are dicks. I think we look at this shit from very different perspectives. The way I see it, you're letting them be the only voice.

 

[Diana]

It's always sad to see people giving up on a good something and trying to distance themselves from it just because a bunch of morons are getting their paws all over it. D: Is just like the people that refuse to see a movie because it's too popular, or the people that hate on anime because a lot of the fanbase is dumb and obnoxious.

I think the fanbase for my little pony is filled with a HELLA BUNCH of crazypervs, and my first thoughts on hearing someone is a fan is wondering if they are too. c____c But I don't let that turn me off from enjoying the show and telling people I am a fan of it too.

You're giving the crazy people the power when you just hand it over to them and LET them keep spouting hate, lies, and bullshit and take over your movements. D: You tell those people to get a bag of dicks. Not let them ruin things.

 

[SacredWarrior]

@SacredWarrior

So basically, the difference between you and me is that I don't compromise my beliefs due to the demands of terrorists.

Jk.

But seriously, I don't see why I should stop calling myself a thing just because I don't fit someone else's definition of that thing or because a handful of other people who call themselves that thing are dicks. I think we look at this shit from very different perspectives. The way I see it, you're letting them be the only voice.

No I'm not letting them be the only voice. I'm not the one giving them the money and power to change things, spread bullshit statistics, and overall fear-monger. I'm obviously speaking out against those fools.

It's NOT a handful of people. It's a LOT of people. More than you actually think. How else do you explain the "real" feminists and social justic advocates (aka the people standing for actual rights and calling people out on their BS rhetoric) leaving and calling themselves other things like anti-feminists, MRAs, or egalitarians (which is me)? Or the big names of social justice (Sarkessian, Quinn, Valenti, Watson) getting lots of money, attention, praise, fame, and fans? Or groups like GamerGate being slandered by mainstream media? They represent what social justice has turned into.

It's become so extreme and stupid that it isn't what it used to be. It started out as a good thing but now it's just complete and utter bullshit. THAT is my perspective. Do you get the point now?

 

[Hecatoncheires]

 

[SacredWarrior]

It's always sad to see people giving up on a good something and trying to distance themselves from it just because a bunch of morons are getting their paws all over it. D: Is just like the people that refuse to see a movie because it's too popular, or the people that hate on anime because a lot of the fanbase is dumb and obnoxious.

I think the fanbase for my little pony is filled with a HELLA BUNCH of crazypervs, and my first thoughts on hearing someone is a fan is wondering if they are too. c____c But I don't let that turn me off from enjoying the show and telling people I am a fan of it too.

You're giving the crazy people the power when you just hand it over to them and LET them keep spouting hate, lies, and bullshit and take over your movements. D: You tell those people to get a bag of dicks. Not let them ruin things.

I never said I gave up on equality and fighting for REAL causes. I'm an egalitarian remember? I'm also a GamerGate supporter.

So how am I supposed to change the bigwigs of social justice and make them disappear off of the face of the Earth? All I can do is speak out which is what I've been doing.

 

[Astaroth]

@SacredWarrior

No, I still entirely disagree with your perspective.

 

[Diana]

I never said I gave up on equality and fighting for REAL causes. I'm an egalitarian remember? I'm also a GamerGate supporter.

So how am I supposed to change the bigwigs of social justice and make them disappear off of the face of the Earth? All I can do is speak out which is what I've been doing.

Keep fighting. 8D But when you say stuff like not wanting to be called a feminist because the assholes have taken it over, that is what I mean about letting the jerkbutts win. It's really important to not let the assholes take things from just because they're louder and more obnoxious and are starting to taint people's perspective. D: Picking a new name to call yourself is not going to work. Because eventually those same crazy people that took over Black Lives matter and Feminism will also take over Egalitarian stuff too. They WILL. It's just a matter of time!

 

[SacredWarrior]

Keep fighting. 8D But when you say stuff like not wanting to be called a feminist because the assholes have taken it over, that is what I mean about letting the jerkbutts win. It's really important to not let the assholes take things from just because they're louder and more obnoxious and are starting to taint people's perspective. D: Picking a new name to call yourself is not going to work. Because eventually those same crazy people that took over Black Lives matter and Feminism will also take over Egalitarian stuff too. They WILL. It's just a matter of time!

Not really. The issue is that BLM and feminism only focus on one demographic and they focus on identity politics. Egalitarianism doesn't do that. Hell the definition FOR egalitarianism is this:

of, relating to, or believing in the principle that all people are equal and deserve equal rights and opportunities.

BLM and feminism do NOT believe that no matter how much they sugarcoat it. Hell they don't even follow definitions of racism and sexism! So no extreme bigwigs are NOT taking over egalitarianism because it's damn near impossible.