Then it seems our tones got mixed up XP The tone I gave you was how I saw your tone -.- I'm going to assume there was a misunderstanding, so lets try one last time :D
This tone? Calm, slightly worn out, one last push for understanding.
You... You realize, we need to kill things to live, right?
You seemed to have missed the part where I said that most people aren't against them dying, or being killed for food.
People are against how they are treated. If they were treated better, then this would hardly be an issue. In fact, we wouldn't even be having this conversation.
I realize that fully ^^ I even mentioned that. (And you seemed to have missed that part... Again DX)
How many times do I have to say i'm not against animals dying for our food, i'm against how they're treated.
Holy fucking shit kiddo. I was just trying to explain why cows are not the same as people.
And i'm trying to explain that it doesn't matter how smart, stupid, ignorant, arrogant, loving, hated something is, they shouldn't be treated so badly.
You SAY you agree that animals should be treated better, yet you make excuses as to why it's okay they are treated as terribly as they are. What you say, and your reasons, don't co-exist consistently.
Humans went many years seeing animals as more objects than anything else, and used that as an excuse to abuse them. Even to de-humanize humans by calling them animals.
Then we started to see "Huh... Animals are more than we thought".
Just a decade ago, many of us thought the goldfish had 7 seconds of memory. As it turns out, we were wrong... WAY wrong, their memory isn't all that bad. We said that animals don't feel pain like we do, but studies on that HEAVILY beg to differ.
We used to say that native Americans were animals, savages. Then we finally came to the conclusion that they aren't as bad as we thought. It was only 60 years ago that blacks were seen as more, and even today, there's still that racism.
What's my point? The same thing is happening right here. People back then thought they understood natives/blacks, and saw them as almost nothing. And then it was proven that it was wrong.
You seem to see animals similarly as people back then saw natives, you think you understand animals, and as proven, it's wrong.
How can we place value on a creature that we don't even understand? You say it's dangerous to place value on something that isn't proven to be like us. Well that's the same mindset of back then with natives/slaves. It wasn't proven that they were like us, so their mistreatment was excused. (It was eventually proven, but people just didn't care. Similarly to now, it's proven animals are quite like us, but many of us still deny that. VERY similarly to how blacks were seen back when they started getting rights)
And why place value in the first place? we feel pain all the same, we all think, we all communicate, we all learn, we all pass down information to the next generation. Yet we pretend like animals don't do any of that, and why? As an excuse to continue treating them the way we do? Because we need to feel special and above them?
If you wanna talk about value, then what's the scale?
An amazing president vs a cat? President probably wins (At least I would)
But even if that cat was human, people will still choose president.
Army dog who saves lives and protects our freedom, or a mass murderer? Is the murderer still worth more than the dog who is doing far more good? If your answer is no, then your scale of species doesn't work. If your answer is still yes... Well at least you're consistent -.-
I guess the ultimate question then, what are you arguing? That we shouldn't see animals as humans? Alright, whatever. (But really, that's the same reason why we shouldn't see Chinese as American. The reason why we shouldn't see animals as humans, is due to culture.)
But why should those reasons of yours be the same reasons as to why it's acceptable to torture them? Why are they the same as to why the natives/blacks were treated badly? Your primary point is being contradicted by your reasons, and your exact reasons are the same responsible for much suffering in the past, even with humans.
Are you starting to see where plausible confusion is coming from?
