White Racism

[Mid]

And how it doesn't exist.

Because you are white, you do not understand racism.

However, everything you say is racist.

You will never understand us.

You are completely missing the point.

You will never know what it is like to be discriminated against.

You are born white, you are privileged.

You just don't get it.

I see comments like these everywhere and honestly...it's starting to annoy me and I'm not even white! For those who watch Arrow/WWE, Stephen Amell got in trouble for tweeting his thoughts on the Ahmed case (the 14 year old who made a clock but was arrested because a teacher thought it was a bomb) where he talked about how people shouldn't stereotype Texas either or something along those lines. Basically two wrongs don't make a right.

He is now a white, privileged racist. Well, according to twitter anyways. The back lash was so bad, he's decided to take a break from social media. People even went so far as to call out his fathering and if anyone follows him on FB or Twitter, then you should know hhow good and proud he is to be a father. And I'm kind of sick of this shit, tbh.

People feel so entitled to their own opinions and with the thought that because you are white, you need to sit down and shut the fuck up...which to me is discriminating.

As a Puerto Rican, I grew up listening to rock, alternative, pop, Jpop...you get the point. The only Spanish music I knew about was Marc Anthony and Jennifer Lopez so I got a lot of teasing from Black people as well as Spanish people because I was "weird." Hell, my family makes fun of me if I listen to a Drake song to were I feel uncomfortable listening to anything around them because they don't like my music taste. I was called "White Girl" all through middle and high school to were I just owned it and became proud of it because I liked what I liked and shouldn't feel ashamed of not fitting in with the mold.

So to get to the point, racism is not just a white person only thing. And I feel that rather then talking like civilized people, everyone just wants to be so offended and say YOU'RE A FUCKING IDIOT WHO DOESN'T GET IT! ...But how can anyone get it, if no one wants to actually talk about it?

Back when Christianity started, Romans persecuted whites because they wanted a different religion...yet I never hear a white person screaming about how they were oppressed and murdered for centuries because they were different.

I always hear about slavery...and truthfully, I'm annoyed with it. Not because it happened and is a major event in American history but because I feel this gives people an excuse to be hateful towards one particular group of people but it's like, your great/grand parents went through it, not you. They have every right to preach about that, not you.

When it comes to saying the "N Word," why is it okay for spanish/blacks to say it but the minute a white person says it, whether it's a song they're singing or a friend they are talking too who they've known for years, they are white racist fucks who know nothing about anything. To me, it just seems very...hypocritical.

How do we become a united nation? One that respects each other as a fellow American.

 

[Shadon Xarian]

The newest trend is white guilt XD People who are feeling guilty for being white. It's interesting, in doing what you're talking about, being a white male is becoming the most discriminated thing there is. Do we deserve it as a whole? Yes. BUT as individuals, no. Like I'm not responsible for what my super racist great x100 ancestors did (Assuming they were racist in the first place XD) But many people seem to think that because i'm white, I'm somehow AT LEAST indirectly responsible.

It's interesting how the start of human history where most/allot of people see people as people and not races are also the first to get this white guilt/victim complex.

 

[Jorick]

Soooo, I'm just gonna preemptively remind everyone about the rules, because this sort of topic can make people go a little bonkers. No arguing with people in a discussion thread, take it to a PM or make a debate thread on the topic if you want to argue about it. Discussion threads are for civil discussions of a topic, not point by point refutation of claims being made.

 

[Diana]

I hate when this topic comes up, cause people get really stupid. o__o In about three pages this topic will descend in to that madness and have to get locked like all the others. >:[

The problem is that people don't understand that you can be BOTH Privileged AND Oppressed at the same time. A Poor White Guy and a Rich Black Guy both have positions of privilege AND positions of oppression. There are A LOT of problems in our society, and it's important for us to recognize where we DO have privilege AND NOT TO FEEL GUILTY ABOUT IT, while also respecting each others issues with oppression instead of getting defensive about it.


All we can do is educate and educate and educate and hope the next generations are smarter. D:

 

[Kestrel]

Nope. Nope, nope, nope.

Segregation doesn't lead to equality. Responsibility has to be taken by the collective, because if not, you are pushing segregation to an even further extent. Who takes responsibility is not about fairness either, because then we'll be arguing forever. The world isn't fair and will never be fair. One person will always have different conditions from another. Rather, it's about everyone taking responsibility for equality. It is something we can only reach if we all unite.

Dat victim-complex thou.

 

[SacredWarrior]

I'm an African-American female and colorism is a HUGE problem in our community. The dark-skinned vs light-skinned debate, the bitterness towards another black person if they date outside of their race, the harassment and bullying that can happen if you don't "act black", etc.

All throughout elementary, middle, and high school, I was teased and picked on for my intelligence (which got me good grades), my nerdiness, my hair (which a lot of people were jealous of), and the fact that one of my best friends was white (we're still good friends to this day). People basically persecuted me because I didn't act black enough for them and once I put them in their place and told them to fuck off, they basically left me alone. I even kicked a guy in the nuts once for smacking my ass.

Needless to say, yeah discrimination and prejudice against whites can exist and if anything, minorities are much worse today because of how much we persecute against our own people for the pettiest shit.

Racism will always exist because of ignorance. Sometimes people become racist out of bitterness. But one thing I will say is that it's taught not born. The only way to end said racism in my opinion is to take all of the ignorant people and push them somewhere else. (Yes I just referenced that XD)

 

[Mid]

I'm an African-American female and colorism is a HUGE problem in our community. The dark-skinned vs light-skinned debate, the bitterness towards another black person if they date outside of their race, the harassment and bullying that can happen if you don't "act black", etc.

All throughout elementary, middle, and high school, I was teased and picked on for my intelligence (which got me good grades), my nerdiness, my hair (which a lot of people were jealous of), and the fact that one of my best friends was white (we're still good friends to this day). People basically persecuted me because I didn't act black enough for them and once I put them in their place and told them to fuck off, they basically left me alone. I even kicked a guy in the nuts once for smacking my ass.

Needless to say, yeah discrimination and prejudice against whites can exist and if anything, minorities are much worse today because of how much we persecute against our own people for the pettiest shit.

Racism will always exist because of ignorance. Sometimes people become racist out of bitterness. But one thing I will say is that it's taught not born. The only way to end said racism in my opinion is to take all of the ignorant people and push them somewhere else. (Yes I just referenced that XD)

OMG I love you so much for this post right now. I've been thinking the same thing and if I try to say something about it, people are like WHAT ARE YOU EVEN SAYING?!

Lol, racism within our own communities is also a big thing. I find it horrible when I hear stories of dark skin ladies bleaching their skin because they have always been told that they would be pretty if they were light skin. Personally, I date black guys and have minor crushes on other races and have received comments on what I like or looks of who the hell are you? It use to bother me but now I'm just like...I'm not gonna live in fear based on other people's opinions.

I wish there was a way that we could teach our future generation to love themselves and each other.

 

[SacredWarrior]

OMG I love you so much for this post right now. I've been thinking the same thing and if I try to say something about it, people are like WHAT ARE YOU EVEN SAYING?!

Lol, racism within our own communities is also a big thing. I find it horrible when I hear stories of dark skin ladies bleaching their skin because they have always been told that they would be pretty if they were light skin. Personally, I date black guys and have minor crushes on other races and have received comments on what I like or looks of who the hell are you? It use to bother me but now I'm just like...I'm not gonna live in fear based on other people's opinions.

I wish there was a way that we could teach our future generation to love themselves and each other.

We can teach them. By raising them and uplifting them and teaching them to not be so impacted so much by the media (which can make a huge difference both ways).

The people you're talking to must be really stupid XD I mean do they have an IQ of -87?

I don't fear anyone and if anyone says anything racist or offensive to me, I'm going off like fireworks on their ass!

 

[GhostJoker]

You're all racist. Even if you're not racist. They're always racist.

 

[Jorick]

Alright, now that I'm not on my phone I can add something more substantive to the thread than a warning about debating.

This nonsense is born from the dark side of identity politics, which is moving closer and closer to becoming the cool new brand of racism with each passing day. The basic concept of identity politics (paying attention to what identity groups people belong to, such as race, gender, sexuality, and so on and looking at how those group identifications influence people) is fine, a good lens through which to view many problems in society. The problems come from adding in and then diluting the hell out of the concepts of oppression and privilege. Back before the dilution, oppression meant prolonged cruelty and privilege meant special advantages accessible only by a select few; the ridiculous side of identity politics has turned oppression and privilege into a binary system where you look at any segment of identity, rank them in order of which one(s) has it generally better than the other(s) in society (with no need for objective fact gathering to do the ranking, just based on feelings and personal experience), and those at the top of the list are privileged and are oppressing every other group below them. You get these fun little identity totem poles where you can point to a particular segment and say "yep, they're oppressed by all those above them, but they're oppressing all those below them." This is why nowadays in social activism circles you'll see gay men being cast both as oppressed by straight people AND as oppressive assholes toward lesbians, bisexuals, and so forth; they're currently ranked second on the sexuality identity totem pole, therefore they're oppressed from one side and privileged from the other.

To people who ascribe to this method of thought, any group that has it even a little better than another is privileged and is automatically oppressing those who are less well off than them. This is patently ridiculous. They take oppression, a term that used to be reserved for slaves and targets of genocide and so forth, and apply it liberally to any segment of identity that has an imbalance. The funny little trick to it is that despite the term being used to refer to minor grievances it still carries a lot of emotional weight because of the historical connotations, so when people say "this group is oppressed!" people often respond with "omg how horrible!" instead of "wait, how are they being oppressed exactly?" The word is losing its power over time as people use it so trivially, but its still got some kick left to it for the time being. Another problem of this sort of identity politics is that it ignores individuality and declares that one's privileged/oppressed status is determined by which identifying labels can be applied to them, not by looking at how they actually behave and treat other people. It's rather dehumanizing when you think about it: you as an individual doesn't matter, you're only one tiny part of the overall group, and that determines your status in the world of social activism.

Now, the reason for that above spiel is because it explains the whole "you can't be racist against white people" and "white people are always racist" thing. See, in identity politics as it pertains to race, white people have been placed at the top of the privilege totem pole; fair enough, if you're looking at the broad brush strokes of race in western nations, white people have had it the best in general in those areas of the world. However, this allows for some shitty things in the minds of the people who agree with these ideas. Another fun part of this atrocious malformation of identity politics is that cruelty against privileged groups is okay because they're privileged so they deserve it. Cruelty toward oppressed groups is horrible, it's racist and sexist and so on, but when that same behavior is turned around it's just mean, but acceptable. This is because these simpletons who view social politics in terms of group labels and a privilege/oppression binary have decided that cruelty toward privileged groups is just the natural and healthy reaction of oppressed minorities railing against their oppressors, so it's not at all a problem. These folks have sought to redefine terms like racism and sexism to be what used to be called "structural racism/sexism", where it's only one of the -isms if it's being done by someone in a position of privilege/power toward an oppressed minority... and thanks to some mental gymnastics they've also decided that something isn't actually worth getting mad about and stopping unless it's one of the -isms, because if it's not one of the evil -isms then it's just bias and that's not a big deal. Thanks to their watering down of the meaning of privilege and oppression, this means that it gives anyone not at the top of an identity group's totem pole carte blanche to say whatever horrible things they want about those above them, because they're a poor oppressed minority so it's just bias, not really harmful or anything. It gives free rein for certain groups to be as racist biased as they want, because they're not harming any oppressed groups, so it's all good.

TL;DR it's some rank bullshit cooked up by the extreme progressive wing of social activism. People have latched onto it because it give them an excuse to spew their hatred and get praised for it, and it's pretty disgusting overall.

Oh, and because I figure that quite possibly ruffled some feathers of anyone who goes in for identity politics, I welcome PMs from people who'd like to tell me I'm a horrible shitlord who has it all wrong. I <3 debates, but this ain't the place.

 

[Esmeray]

Yeah, I've actually been told stuff like that before. When the whole ordeal of the white cops killing the black kids, and how I kept saying that it was police brutality and not just racism I kept getting the whole "you don't understand because you are a privileged white girl who doesn't have to fear the cops." ಠ_ಠ

And I could only laugh because my family had troubles with police brutality not even a month before recieveing those comments. Also how the fuck am I privileged? I live in a border line poor/lower class middle family that struggles to pay the bills every month. I don't qualify for grants, or other governement aids because I wasnt born into a "minority". Yet I'm "privileged". ಠ_ಠ

Like I understand that people have it worse than me, there are homeless people on the streets and malnourished kids in Africa. So yes I'm more well off than others, but so are some of the people screaming their heads off about white privilege and racism. ಠ_ಠ

 

[Grumpy]

This thread is not gonna end well.

I shall sit chuckling in the corner until it kicks off.

 

[Brovo]

He is now a white, privileged racist. Well, according to twitter anyways. The back lash was so bad, he's decided to take a break from social media. People even went so far as to call out his fathering and if anyone follows him on FB or Twitter, then you should know hhow good and proud he is to be a father. And I'm kind of sick of this shit, tbh.

"Human beings either function as individuals or as members of a pack. There's a switch inside us, deep in our spirit, that you can turn one way or the other. It's almost always the case that our worst behaviour comes out when we're switched to the mob setting. The problem with a lot of software designs is that they switch us to that setting." -Jaron Lanier.

Seriously. Get most of these people alone and have a casual conversation with them, and they'll typically be rational people who have deep concerns for society. Just don't talk to them about race, and you could even perhaps befriend most of them. It's when you get them into groups and involve peer pressure that shit goes totally fucking bonkers: Because the loudest are also most often the most extreme, and it's much easier to deflect blame for the negative things if you're doing it in a group than if you have to assume responsibility alone. All of this nonsensical crap comes from a collectivist mindset that categorizes people into boxes, and randomly names one box the "purity" box by which all others should be judged inferior in one way or another. It's why the progressive stack exists: Irrelevant to your individual merit, desires, and deductions, if you are classed in a box that is interpreted as superior to another box, your words are automatically lesser in value.

It's seductive, too. It's much easier to believe that the world is out to get you and that you're the victim, rather than accepting the coldest truth about the universe: It doesn't give a shit about you at all. You're a tiny, insignificant thing, and your concerns, and how "unfair" life is, are totally and utterly irrelevant to it. The same life-giving ball of hydrogen and helium in the sky gives us cancer for fucks sake, mother nature don't give a shit. But, hey, we're humans, so we anthropomorphise that shit: The reason why I was born poor is because it was the fault of those damn, dirty jews white people. Laws are irrelevant. Millions of exceptions to this rule that live, breath, and have their own lives in poverty are also irrelevant. Logic and reason are irrelevant.

This eternal quest for purity is pitiable. Nobody ever learns. Your life has no meaning or purpose beyond what you make of it, but that doesn't stop us from deluding ourselves otherwise... Because we're all the heroes in our own stories, and heroes can never do wrong.

As for this thread, who knows. Maybe it won't crash and burn. Maybe my everlasting optimism will be right for once and all the crazy, dehumanizing, collectivist psychotics that normally party crash this stuff will leave it alone. I mean, pigs could fly too, right?

 

[Darog]

Am I white? white and British.

Do I feel guilty about being white and British? lolno, why the fuck should I?

*opens the gate for the chaff that will get offended at this*

Come on in! I'll give you some tea, feel free to take some crumpets and biscuits too ^^.

 

[Saito Hajime]

Where I come from, New Zealand, we have a native group which is kind of like the Native Indians in America, called the Maori. They have this one activist who is probably the worst of the lot, called Hone Harawira. When this one guy (a Maori, FYI) criticised him for using a taxpayer funded trip to visit Paris, part of his response (via email) was "Gee Buddy, do you believe that white man bullshit too do you? White motherf***ers have been raping our lands and ripping us off for centuries and all of a sudden you want me to play along with their puritanical bullshit....And, quite frankly, I don't give a shit what you or anyone else thinks about it. OK?" However, a prominent Maori MP claimed his views were common and weren't racist because of that.

So, you know, he's obviously not racist.

Frankly, it all stems from that notion of racism being "prejudice and power". It's as if people are okay with admitting to being prejudiced, as long as they can say people of their identity don't make up 51% of public institutions of whatever their idea of power is.

They also seem to hate taking the discussion out of the USA, because of course that's where their arguments all fall apart. I have been told I was "desperate" for bringing up the example of Japan in a discussion on this topic, as if my alleged "desperation" discredited anything I had to say. Fallacies, fallacies everywhere.

 

[Hellis]

Is it quite possible that white people on average face less racism? Yes. Does that mean it is nonexistent; no. Does being a minority with a history of getting shafted give you the right to be divisive and racist? No. Is it somewhat understandable that people fall into the behavior due to said history? Yes. Does these individuals actions aid equality? No. How do you fix it? By setting aside differences and talking. Will it happen anytime soon; Likely not. Humans are emotion driven, history doesn't just go away and cultures will clash. Discrimination still happen, people get hurt from it and tempers flare.

Silver lining; We have made great strides in several areas. We will continue to make progress. Logic and Empathy leads to understanding.


That is my position on it in a nutshell.


On the subject of taking pride in your "Race"
Ehhh. I don't feel any shame in being white. I was born this way. It is who I am. I am already a diagnosed depressive. I don't need more self loathing in my life.

 

[Shadon Xarian]

I'm an African-American female and colorism is a HUGE problem in our community. The dark-skinned vs light-skinned debate, the bitterness towards another black person if they date outside of their race, the harassment and bullying that can happen if you don't "act black", etc.

All throughout elementary, middle, and high school, I was teased and picked on for my intelligence (which got me good grades), my nerdiness, my hair (which a lot of people were jealous of), and the fact that one of my best friends was white (we're still good friends to this day). People basically persecuted me because I didn't act black enough for them and once I put them in their place and told them to fuck off, they basically left me alone. I even kicked a guy in the nuts once for smacking my ass.

Needless to say, yeah discrimination and prejudice against whites can exist and if anything, minorities are much worse today because of how much we persecute against our own people for the pettiest shit.

Racism will always exist because of ignorance. Sometimes people become racist out of bitterness. But one thing I will say is that it's taught not born. The only way to end said racism in my opinion is to take all of the ignorant people and push them somewhere else. (Yes I just referenced that XD)

You know, one of my older black friends told me that's how it was in school. I wasn't quite sure I believed him though. I couldn't quite comprehend that blacks would bully other blacks for having good grades/being smart. Not being black enough sure, whatever XD But I never thought that "being black enough" also included having bad grades o.o I didn't think it was quite that bad -.- (Yeeeaaaaahhhhh, I'm sheltered XP But I exposed mahself to quite a bit of darkness online so yeah)

The only way to end said racism in my opinion is to take all of the ignorant people and push them somewhere else.
Guess what that makes you??????????? >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D >:D (And it already exist. Basically any ghetto out there/websites like tumblr -.-) I might argue that putting them somewhere else just gave them more power as they were able to group up due to being put in close proximity and being exposed heavily to a single type of not so good culture(s)

 

[Dipper]

I'll never be able to wrap my head around the ultra-progressive view on racism. The very definition of racism says you can be racist to white people, and I'm more inclined to believe the dictionary than I am a screeching wingnut.

Actually, it's kind of funny. I didn't really start to notice race until this bizarre brand of progressivism started becoming more popular. I've also been confused by them, because to some I'm white, to others I'm not because I'm half italian. I wasn't aware italians weren't white, but I guess that just shows you how skewed the American perception of race is.

Really now, most of the people screaming how you can't be racist to white people are people who downright pitiful human beings who want special treatment and/or privileges, or need to pick up a dictionary as soon as possible.

 

[Dervish]

Am I white? white and British.

Do I feel guilty about being white and British? lolno, why the fuck should I?

*opens the gate for the chaff that will get offended at this*

Come on in! I'll give you some tea, feel free to take some crumpets and biscuits too ^^.

You should, like, apologize for your ancestors treating Earth like a bigass Risk board and being general dinks, you turbo-privileged limey jerk. >:[

One of my friends is most definitely one of those Tumblr keyboard SJW people who is as white on rice in a glass of milk on a paper plate in a snow storm who frequently says things like "fucking white boys" and we had an argument one day about how she believes you can't be racist against white people because whites are the, for a lack of better term, dominant race in Western society. Now to head you off at the pass, I don't mean dominant as in "we own you bitches", largely because I don't have a Confederate battle flag flying behind my rusty pick-up truck, just that our societies were pretty much founded by and the majority are white people. To be fair to her, she definitely acknowledges and knows that people can be totally shitty to other people and we agree pretty much on everything about discrimination and how it can happen to anybody from anyone, it's just for whatever reason, she's of the opinion racism only applies if you're a minority. I tried to explain to her that she's pretty much describing institutionalized racism/ racial bias, but alas, it's one of those things where you pretty much have the same position but you can't agree on what to call it. Catsup, ketchup. Whatever. Not worth arguing about it.

The thing is, you can't really change what racism means because it is literally defined as discriminating against someone or a group of people based on their race or ethnicity. If a group of pissed-off teenagers at the native reservation I work in approach me one day and then beat the crap out of me because I'm a white guy who's on their land (and for the love of god, they would never do such a thing because everyone I've met there has been super nice, I'm just using an extreme example based off of a "what if" in my day to day life where I actually work somewhere where I'm the racial minority), that would be racism, no ifs, ands, or buts. The thing is, anybody can be a racist, regardless of what race they are, and it's not exclusively a "white vs. everyone else" thing. I'm sure you've all heard somebody of another race just rag on about another at some point in your lives.

The thing people who are behind the whole "you can't be racist against white people" mentality is it's one of those things that probably started with good intentions and is ideally supposed to call attention to unfair treatment of minorities, like some kind of computer-age affirmative action. But by the every effort of calling attention to race and drawing lines in the sand, you're making problems worse - especially for the people you're trying to help. I mean, hell, in this thread alone there's been at least two people who identify as non-white who think that it's kind of getting ridiculous. I don't know about you, but I've always been the kind of guy who never really thinks about somebody's race or religion (not to open that can of worms) unless people keep talking about it. In college, and when I was in the military, I knew all sorts of people from all sorts of backgrounds and ethnicity and honestly, I feel like a richer person for it. They weren't treated any different from the white students/ soldiers, and we all mingled freely and valued each other based on who we were as people. The only time race was even brought up was between friends who wanted to find out more about somebody's culture, or in the case of one of my best friends in the army who was Chinese and myself, we called each other Mao and Hitler playfully all the time because friends are shits to each other from time to time. One of our soldiers in our basic training course was a Pakistani Muslim guy who was never once treated any differently for any of that (and this was only a few years after 9/11), and the only time we poked fun at him was because he was easily the smallest guy on the course, so of course the instructors paired him up with the 6'04", 210 pound Irish guy when it came time to do fireman carries and rescue drags.

The reason I bring those guys up as examples is because it stands out to me as a perfect example of a multi-racial group of people who really just treated each other as people, and it would legitimately upset me if I found out any of those guys I was buddies with ended up hitting some really bad hardships because they were discriminated against. Being multicultural can be such an enriching thing, and I feel like it's really not a hard concept to just treat everyone you meet on a case-by-case basis and judge them based on who they are and not what they look like. And it goes both ways; I don't know what anyone would hope to accomplish by telling me that my opinions and worth is invalid because I'm white.

It just seems to be that blaming all racial problems and inequity on the majority instead of trying to bring people together to, I don't know, come up with an actual solution, is exactly the wrong way to do it, and posting and reblogging shit from behind a computer isn't changing anything, no matter how indignant you claim to be about it.

 

[Esmeray]

the majority are white people.

I would like to point out that white people are actually becoming a minority. Slowly. Steadily. Don't quote me on that though, this is something I've been told by various high school teachers and college professors. I would do the actual maths myself but I'm to lazy for that.....and math is mental abuse to humans so...no. - w -