New site maintenance policies: Thread archival and NSFW

[Jorick]

But my point remains... Why is the WHOLE of the community being restricted for the actions of a few? I understand that it's for publicity and public opinion of the site as a whole, but why can't you simply punish the ones who go too far rather than making a blanket law that pertains to EVERYONE? Certainly there has to be a better way...

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the rules here. It's not about punishing people, it's about making the site usable for everyone in as convenient a way as possible. What you're asking us to do is disregard all the people who want to access the site at work, or around children, or around parents, or with friends around who might have issues with it, or in public, or so forth, all for the sake of you and others being able to use sexy avatars. I can pretty much guarantee you that the number of people who want to use Iwaku in places in which random NSFW images could get them in trouble vastly outnumbers the amount of people who want to use sexy avatars that cross the NSFW line. I know it sucks to fall into that minority group and feel like you're being needlessly restricted in your creative choices, but it's about doing what's best for the site as a whole. The benefit to this policy is that a majority of our userbase is being protected and aided in using the site at their convenience, and we've decided the cost of some people being unhappy about not having prominent tits and a lot of skin showing in there avatar was totally worth it.

We're not going to do something negative for a majority of the site's users just to please you and a small group of other people, especially when it comes with the major drawback of attracting the sort of users that we would prefer to keep off of Iwaku. Sometimes life is unfair like that, and you'll just have to live with it.

 

[Lylith]

I don't like breaking rules. I simply don't see your side, or the necessity of this one in particular.

That doesn't mean you're right or wrong, it just means I don't agree and I wish the rule wasn't in place.

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the rules here.

I don't believe I do... I'm pretty sure the rule was made very clear. The REASON for the rule and the thoughtful consideration behind it is what I was questioning.

Sometimes life is unfair like that, and you'll just have to live with it.

Life is never fair... I just expected a reprieve from the monotony of it here on Iwaku.

 

[Winter]

You are incorrect, mostly because the word "preemptive" in law doesn't mean "creating a law to prevent something from happening"...

Preemptive laws are laws where the Federal laws must be taken into consideration before local or state laws.

If you have evidence to the contrary, please list it. But the explanation of preemptive laws can easily be found if you use google. I encourage you to do so.

But my point remains... Why is the WHOLE of the community being restricted for the actions of a few? I understand that it's for publicity and public opinion of the site as a whole, but why can't you simply punish the ones who go too far rather than making a blanket law that pertains to EVERYONE? Certainly there has to be a better way...

I think you'll find that preemption holds definition within and without federal law and is applied to multiple legislation's past present and future intended. Googling the word 'preemption law' and having the page read back to you from the first link is hardly extensive research and deviates from the points being made.

Rules, laws, legislation's and more are put in places as preventative measures to guard against unfavorable outcomes, usually for all parties involved. To bring the train back on the rails, the NSFW policy exists because we are 'preempting' a possible situation, one of which has already been explained to you.

We simply do not want new members coming here and gaining the opinion that we're here for strictly libertine role play. No survey has been conducted, no particular member or group is at fault for the implementation of this policy. We have sought to consistently and productively improve the site for the benefit of all the people who come here.

We believe in the policy as we do with all the rules we have in place meant to protect you and the site from very serious legal repercussions. And we'll continue to do our best in ensuring that Iwaku remains a safe place for a broad and dynamic scope of writers, no matter who they are and where they comes from

As I might have mentioned before, we have appropriate places designated for libertine interactions so we're not out right siding against that kind of material. However in the public areas and within spaces on profiles where any and all can see, we'd like those spaces kept clear of libertine material, for the benefit of all.

 

[Lylith]

we have appropriate places designated for libertine interactions

Since we're holding judgements now, I'll explain myself...

Contrary to your obvious impression, I don't enjoy sexual role play and I'm not here for that, as my 1x1 partners can tell you first hand. I've specifically warned them that I'm not here for that and I won't participate in any role play that focuses on extensive sexual content.

I understand that you don't want to give OTHER people the impression that Iwaku is "all about that"... I understand. But some of us just enjoy the freedom. Expressing myself in the form of my avatar artwork was one of my favorite ways to do it, and now my freedom to do so is limited by more than my own desires. No matter whose fault it is, it's still an unwelcome (especially since no one has actually "done anything" to incur this change, and this is a "preemptive" rule... )

If you want to blame someone, blame all the people who have complained

 

[Astaroth]

Okay, that's enough. Lodging complaints is one thing but this thread isn't a place for legalese and accusations. I also do not appreciate being quoted out of context for the sake of semantics.

Please keep all comments restricted to your opinions or questions on the archival and NSFW policies or I'm locking this thread. This is directed at all of you, before anyone cries about being singled out.

 

[Tempest]

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@Astaroth

Papa, when do locked threads get archived?

*goes to my corner now*

 

[Astaroth]

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@Astaroth

Papa, when do locked threads get archived?

*goes to my corner now*

When they expire according to their respective forum timeframe policy, or when Security Staff decide it's appropriate.

 

[Rosedrachen]

I draw some lewd stuff, including things that go to the category of 'cartoon porn' based on RPs here but I agree with this rule. I tend to open Iwaku at work and rather not having my coworkers asking why am I staring a lewd avatar. One of my old avatars actually breaks this new rule, but I already changed it a long time ago on my own realization how it could bring some problems.

 

[Elle Joyner]

Here's the thing. There are beaches and there are nude beaches. Iwaku isn't a family friendly site, but it is also not an adults only site. Rules and guidelines exist because as much as possible, everyone should be allowed to feel comfortable where they are.

There will always be rules that someone doesn't like or agree with... But at the end of the day, all the admins are doing is trying to make Iwaku as comfortable and safe a place as possible for every member. And I think we can all agree that this is a pretty great environment because of that.

Most of us are mature enough to handle tasteful nudity or sexuality, sure... But the facts are this is a roleplaying site, not an art gallery. People... some as young as thirteen, come here to roleplay.

There are showcasing threads for art, but an avatar doth not a showcase make. It might be important to look at what Iwaku is meant to be, as sometimes perspective can be enlightening.

 

[firejay1]

There are beaches, there are nude beaches, and then there is Nudist Beach.

NSFW

Okay, I've had my fun, sorry, continue with your serious conversation.

 

[Lylith]

perspective can be enlightening

I really don't have much else to say about this topic.

 

[LuckycoolHawk9]

Actually, I want a clarification myself. We have been focusing on the female anatomy so much, where is the line drawn on the male one. Like, obviously, no full nudes and stuff like that, I understand all of that. But, what about pictures where there is some exposure of the male chest? Or just a shirtless upper body? ( Face or faceless) Like, we have seen sample of female, what would be an example of acceptable male images and unacceptable male images? ( Is my current avatar acceptable?)

@Astaroth

 

[Astaroth]

Actually, I want a clarification myself. We have been focusing on the female anatomy so much, where is the line drawn on the male one. Like, obviously, no full nudes and stuff like that, I understand all of that. But, what about pictures where there is some exposure of the male chest? Or just a shirtless upper body? ( Face or faceless) Like, we have seen sample of female, what would be an example of acceptable male images and unacceptable male images? ( Is my current avatar acceptable?)

@Astaroth

Unfortunately, there is a prevailing double-standard about chests when it comes to male vs. female. Topless males are considered okay when topless women aren't.

That said, I actually have talked about guidelines for male bodies. Lemme just take out all the female specific stuff for you:

- Images that draw eyes to genitalia or breasts through their composition. Sexually-charged facial expressions and figures.

- See-through clothing, panty shots, or clothing that barely covers genitals or female nipples except in cases of non-sexualized activity-appropriate apparel such as swimwear.

- Sexually suggestive poses, such as leaning in to enhance cleavage, bouncing breasts, hands in crotches, spread legs, butts turned up at the "camera", blow-job face, or any pose that looks like a cropped hentai still where there's something sexual happening out of the frame.

- Exposed penis, vagina, butt cheeks, female nipples, or majority-nude figures. Over-generous side-boob and cleavage.

- Visible camel-toe or bulges.

- Anything that's obviously intended to look like cum. It doesn't matter if it's "just ice cream".

- Sex toys or bondage gear such as ball gags.

- Pornography. Erections. Cum. Visible intercourse, be it penetrative or not. This is not allowed on Iwaku period.

As you can see, more of this is neutral or male-specific than it is female-specific.

In short, shirtless male figures are fine- unless they're posed provocatively or attention is drawn to their junk.

As to your current avatar, I'm a little confused. Did you change it since you asked? Because I'm not sure why you'd ask if a goofy photo of a fully-dressed man is a problem. o__o

 

[LuckycoolHawk9]

As you can see, more of this is neutral or male-specific than it is female-specific.

In short, shirtless male figures are fine- unless they're posed provocatively or attention is drawn to their junk.

As to your current avatar, I'm a little confused. Did you change it since you asked? Because I'm not sure why you'd ask if a goofy photo of a fully-dressed man is a problem. o__o

That's my paranoia of the expression. Also, thanks for the clarity.

 

[Astaroth]

Whoops, fucked up the coding. All fixed now.

 

[Astaroth]

When I'm talking about facial expressions, guys, I mean shit like this:

Spoiler

Okay? You're not going to get asked to change something just because your avatar depicts an open mouth.

C'mon.

 

[firejay1]

Are you telling me this isn't NSFW?!?!?!?!

 

[Eru]

Are you telling me this isn't NSFW?!?!?!?!

You forgot the ending!

 

[IntrusivePenDesperateSword]

Surely cannibalism is off-limits. Surely there's gotta be a rule against this madness!

(I'll stop soon, please don't hurt me)

 

[lostfaith]

I really love this change; I feel like it solves the problem in an effective way without creating more problems. I wish this had been in place back when I was a CV for liberteen (bluestar was still called that back then, was a while ago) when half my job besides archival was putting suggestive images in spoilers. However, I do have a question abouf one thing--

indicates premeditated and explicit intent to commit violence on others or oneself (threats of assault, murder, suicide, and self-harm).

How strict is this? I get that, say, posting a suicide note wouldn't be allowed, but say someone posted a thread in counseling asking for help with self-harm, and said something implying/stating that they'll probably/will self-harm again? What about images of cutting scars, burn marks, or the like? Would they just need to be in spoilers? What if it was an image of a fresh or still bleeding cut?