ADVICE WANTED Tired of being tired

Discussion in 'COUNSELING' started by Hatsune Candy, Sep 20, 2016.

  1. This a problem that has plagued me for a few years now. I don't if it's because of stress, anxiety, bad sleeping habits, or some mixture of the three, but for whatever reason I cannot for the life of me stay on a consistent sleep schedule. Just when I think I'm on the right track, I'm suddenly veered off of it with absolutely no idea why.

    One of the major issues I face is getting to sleep at the right time. More often than not I put off going to bed as long as I physically can, even when I'm incredibly tired from, say, pulling an all nighter the night before. And, to makes matter worse, once I've finally forced myself to go to bed, I frequently struggle to fall asleep. I'll toss and turn for what feels like forever before I either give up or drift off to sleep, only to wake up a few hours later and start to process all over again. Oh, but that's not the end of it, on the nights that I don't have any of the problems listed above I have a tendency to oversleep by a wide margin, which just completely screws me over and often leaves me with an excruciating headache.

    Honestly, my circadian rhythms are so far off balance I am genuinely worried that I'll never be able to fix them. I've talked to my doctor, I've talked to a counselor, I've done research online and tried every possible solution I could fine, but nothing's worked. The problem is, like I mentioned, I don't know what the cause is, I only know the symptoms (i.e. insomnia).
  2. I have a very similar problem, and as a result I feel tired all the time. Though I think my reasoning behind my being tired all the time is maybe mild depression. Of course I've never visited a therapist so that hasn't been confirmed in any way. Anyways, yeah I can never seem to fall asleep at the proper time, normally at the proper time I don't "feel" like I need to sleep so I don't try until its almost four am and my eyes are starting to burn. When I try to fall asleep at a proper time or even at all I tend to toss and turn, and more often than not I just end up taking my phone out and either read some fan fiction until I pass out or I listen to ASMR to lull myself into relaxing my body and mind to ease myself into sleeping. When I finally manage to fall asleep I end up over sleeping since I didn't pass out until early morning. When I manage to fall asleep at a decent time I end up waking up four hours later rather than staying asleep for 12 like I normally would if I fall asleep at three am.

    Basically I know how you feel, and it sucks major ass. I've had this problem for couple years now, and I've tried several different ways to fall asleep. Drinking water or milk before bed, making my bed every morning so it feels nicer to get in bed, but ASMR has been the most helpful, and most nights I can't even fall asleep unless I listen to it while I lay in bed.

    Unfortunately I'm not sure if you've tried that, and if you have all I can say is that that sucks major ass. However, if you did visit a professional about this they most likely would have prescribed you with sleeping either you didn't visit a doctor or the ones you visited need to be fired from their jobs.
  3. @Vio Glad to know I'm not the only one.

    I'm not sure how I feel ASMR though, personally I don't really find it very relaxing. I prefer to just have a constant background noise like a loud fan or something and that helps somewhat, although not by much.

    Now, there are two reasons my doctor didn't prescribed me sleeping pills. For one he prescribed me anxiety medication instead, since I have problems with social anxiety he figured that might have been affecting my ability to sleep; it hasn't helped any though. The other reason is that I didn't want them. Sleeping pills are meant to only be a temporary solution, but it is very easy to become dependent on them. Furthermore, sleeping pills don't allow you to achieve REM sleep, and that's bad because REM sleep is the single most important stage of sleep there is. So, bottom line, sleeping pills are not an option.
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  4. Oh there are plenty of asmrists that simply do white noise such as tapping and things of that nature. There are few that have posted recordings of storms, winds, ect. The thing with ASMR is that it is broad, and you have to really look to find something that you like. It took me a while to find the type that I like, and more specifically my search as paid off with finding a certain video. I listen to the same video EVERY night now and it never fails to put me to sleep. I literally fall asleep at least twenty minutes into the video. I encourage you not to give up at finding what works for you though. There has to be something out there that'll put you yo sleep. :3

    As for the pills, I had no idea about that! I agree that medication is supposed to he a temporary fix, and that it can be easy to become to dependant on them. I would know as I heavily rely on a combo of aleve and tylonol to cure my headaches. In fact I normally take two of each, and for the really bad ones (migraines), three tylonol and two aleve. Sometimes even those don't work or I'll get impatient and take more. I've been told this is really really bad for your stomach, and you could thin the lining of your stomach by constantly taking pain relievers. I can only imagine what getting addicted to sleeping pills could do.
  5. Be careful with the Tylenol, I don't about the thinning of the stomach lining, but I know for a fact that taking too much Tylenol, aka Acetaminophen, at once can cause liver damage/failure. Be wary of the recommended dosage.

    Anyways, back on topic, I guess I'll give ASMR a shot, I didn't realize it was so diverse. And if it doesn't work out, maybe I can try listening to some relaxing music instead.
  6. Have you had a sleep study done already?
  7. Ya know, I haven't, and I really should, but I'm just not sure I'll be able to. Partially because the idea of sleeping in a foreign place with a bunch of things attached to my head while people monitor my brain activity makes me really anxious, and I kinda fill like that anxiety would negatively affect the results in someway. Also, I simply just don't have a lot of time to do something like that, if only I had thought to do it doing Summer break :/

    I'll probably talk to my doctor about.
    #7 Hatsune Candy, Sep 21, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2016
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  8. o_o That must depend on the pill. I find it very hard to believe that not a single sleep aid pill can get you into REM sleep.

    I mean, you can take melatonin supplements, for example. Melatonin is the stuff that your brain produces to get you to sleep in the first place. So taking additional melatonin at the right time can help get you to sleep the way that your body is naturally supposed to. I don't know what kind of sleeping pills don't allow you to achieve REM sleep, but that certainly can't be the case for melatonin pills.

    Personally, I found melatonin pills to be helpful when I dealt with some mild insomnia. It was good for putting my body back onto a normal sleep schedule. Even without the pills, I felt like I was still getting tired when I was supposed to, because being on the melatonin helped get me into a good sleep pattern that was relatively easy to maintain once I stopped taking it. I don't know if you've ever talked with your doctor about melatonin pills, but they're available over-the-counter and, like I said, it's the same stuff your brain makes, so it seems like it would have the fewest adverse affects, especially if you start with a low dosage.

    I understand what you're saying about becoming dependent on it -- but if you feel completely hopeless about your sleep schedule and you just want to not feel so exhausted, well, I'd rather have a temporary solution than no solution.

    And even if you do get hooked on melatonin pills -- well... healthy people are technically just as dependent on melatonin as you would be. The only difference is that theirs is naturally produced by their own bodies, and your body isn't making enough so you're taking more in from an outside source. You may worry that you won't be able to function if it's taken away from you, but, neither would a healthy person.

    In fact, the fear of "dependency" on these kinds of things is a bit of an irrational one, imho. Like... why would you be upset with yourself for needing a certain kind of pill if you started taking it to fulfill a certain need to begin with? No one seems to think it's unhealthy to be "dependent" on eyeglasses in order to see properly. Sure, the biological makeup of your eyes may be out of your control -- but can't the same be said for your brain if it's not making enough of the chemicals it needs to function right? Why is it that artificial aids that make up for physical disabilities are ok, but the same can't be said for mental ones?
  9. Well, of course not all sleeping pills prevent REM sleep, but most at least affect the stages of sleep in someway, and it's not always good.

    Now, being dependent on glasses is different from being dependent on sleeping pills. Glasses don't affect the chemistry of your brain, it's not a drug. Glasses just bend light in such a way to allow the visual impaired to see the world as through they have perfect vision (thank god for that, I'd be blind without 'em), it's very easy to see how harmless it is. With drugs, it's not always clear how exactly they will affect our health, after all, it's different from person to person. It's important to be cautious when putting stuff like that into your body, especially when it's specifically designed to have an affect on what is arguably the single most important organ in our entire body.

    As for melatonin pills? Oh boy, they are something else. The problem there is they're not classified as a drug, they're considered a dietary supplement or sometime even a herbal supplement. What's wrong with that? Quite a lot, actually. Supplements are not subject to FDA regulations, or any regulations at all really. Federal law does not require for a supplement to be considered safe before marketing, nor does it require the manufacturer to prove the any of the claims on the label of dietary supplements. The only time the FDA as any authority on the matter is after the product has be released into the market and people have been harmed. Seriously, you can find all this and more on the FDA's website.

    Uh... wow, got a bit off topic there, sorry about that.
  10. Well of course you should be more cautious. I understand that drugs are obviously more complicated. However, my point was that I don't see how the concept of dependency alone is such a bad thing. Yeah, drugs are tricky, which is why it can be hard to find one that works when it comes to most mental health issues. But if a person does find a drug that's working well for them? Then I don't think it's a bad thing to be "dependent" on it. Like I said, healthy people are dependent on the same chemicals -- they just don't need an outside source for it. Of course it's a good thing to monitor how your body reacts to different drugs and to watch out for adverse affects. And while the potential harm that can come from various medications is always something to be aware of, I don't think that the mere concept of regularly taking a certain medication is something to fear.

    Yes, the brain is probably the most important organ in our bodies -- which is why it's good to be careful about adverse affects from certain drugs, but that's also why I for one am very grateful that so many different options for drugs like these exist in the first place, so that the most important organ in my body can have some support in the areas in which it lacks. o_o

    In any case, I'll step off my soapbox, now. Obviously the best thing for you to do right now is to discuss this sort of thing with a doctor. I still think sleeping pills could do you some good if you can find a type of pill that works well for you -- but, ultimately, the pros and cons of that sort of thing are for you to consider.

    I do hope you find some sort of solution to your sleep problem, whatever that solution turns out to be. So, good luck with all that.
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  11. Well in that case, you're right, it's not necessarily a bad thing, at least in principle. But I just personally don't like the idea of being dependent on medication in order to function normally, especially when it's intended to only be a temporary solution and I know I can solve the problem without it. I already hate the fact that I have to take ADHD and anxiety pills, my eventual goal is to not have to take any, adding sleeping pills to equation somewhat hinders that.
  12. Funny you mention ADHD pills, since that's sort of exactly where my perspective on this comes from. Some days I worry about being "dependent" on that, as well -- but, then I remind myself, I started taking it for a reason to begin with, and I'm certainly grateful for what it's done for me. I take the stuff so that my brain can function a bit more similarly to a "normal" person, and there's no real reason to be ashamed of that, especially since I experience very few side effects from taking the stuff (and apparently that makes me one of the lucky ones, given all the adderall horror stories I've heard...) Overall, I'm very happy that I have something that can more-or-less "fix" problems that I'd otherwise have no choice but to just deal with. So, if it works for me, then I shouldn't feel bad about it, just like I wouldn't feel bad about needing glasses, as my need for both of these things comes from biological factors that I can't control.

    But, like I said, it's your decision in the end. I guess I just wanted to clarify that I do know what it's like to be dependent on medication for this sort of thing, and that I'm not just some neurotypical person talking out of my ass. :P
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  13. So, I know this is like a week behind but a couple of quick suggestions:

    ADHD meds can have crazy effects on sleep. It's not uncommon at all for folks taking ADHD meds to also be taking a sleep aide or melatonin. If your ADHD meds are working well for you otherwise, it might not be worth the hassle to switch them but maybe you should talk to your doctor about switching types. See if you have better luck.

    Another thing that could help is keeping tech out of your bedroom (I say as I sit on my bed with my laptop). The blue light from computer and phone screens wreaks havoc on your natural melatonin production. If you can, plan to power down an hour or two before you go to sleep. Resist using your phone as a clock at night, instead, if you must get a clock find one with orange or red numbers. This is a big struggle for me but it's something I've found that definitely makes a difference.

    I won't go too deep into melatonin except to say that I swear by it personally. I don't take it every night, but if I'm trying to adjust my sleep cycle back after a few days of being off work for example it's a life saver. Supposedly there's a ton of melatonin in dark cherries (which my pills taste like cherries so guess it makes sense!) so one thing you could do is get yourself a jar of low/no sugar dark cherry juice and have a glass every evening as part of your bedtime routine. When you run out of juice, stop using it. No big deal. Personally I've always thought of melatonin as a really short term solution anyway. Switching time zones, setting a new bed time, back from spring break, that sort of thing.

    And then setting a bed time and sticking too it. Again hard but a goodie.
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