Orochi says we should recount all the karma and posts based on New Iwaku!

Should we recount the karma and posts based on what you ACTUALLY have on Iwaku 4.0?


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Orochi

GET OFF MY LAWN :E
I totally will if you let me, Diana-wuss!

And I think that was a drunken-post by WMD-bro, we should totally do that more often!
 

CoffeeCake

"We wait all night for calls like these."
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Meh. No side yet.

For the record I prefer phrases to numerical karma. In fact, I strongly dislike the latter. Jazz up the phrases, if necessary, but I can do without seeing the numbers. I'll explain more if pressed.

We can reset posts and then have a thread called "The Mods Museum of Awesomeness", where we boast about what we did on the other site.


For once, I'm divided... which means I can't bully people to influence the outcome of this poll...


And if I take the third option, then that would mean I suck... even though by clicking that it proves I don't suck... but then they very act of voting on that enforces the truth of my sucking... yet being conscious of the fact negates my own suckery....

*implodes*

It's almost eerie how much this sounds like me doing a bad Asmo impersonation without bothering to get into character.
 

Jack Shade

Anti-Hero
Genres
Magical, Fantasy, Supernatural, Sci Fi, Steam Punk, Noir, HORROR, and I'm willing to try Romance.
Our goal is not to make money?

Someone forgot to give me THAT memo.

:(
 
W

Warmaster Death

Guest
Now, I'm not sure if WMD was talking to me or not (since it seems likely he was talking to Xnijmai or whoever), but he's wrong about the benevolent dictatorship bit. See, all members joined Iwaku of our their own accord, and moderators are just members with power intended to settle disputes between other members. Admins are just members who are responsible for keeping the website up. Both the mods and admins of Iwaku, at least in the present state, have been normal members before and should understand what it's like.

Nobody in authority on a forum should ever act like dictators, at least not in my book. Especially if said forum's goal is not to make money.

they hold the power, and weild it for the good of all.
they are not elected, but chosen. whether tat is by the admins or themselves is irrelevent.

there is not election or vote.

thus it is a benevolent dictatorship.
do not confuse it with a malevolent dictatorship, which is what i fear you mean when you say "act like a dictator"

we are but humble members, and on our best days we may reach teh dizzying peak of moddom, but thats it.
we do no have the right to demand anything.

we have the right to ask.
now call me whatever the fuck you like, but I'm a loyalist.

and i do see it as our job to roleplay not whine about stuff.

i mean, when you said "this change favors mods" i lost my temper, and rather than post drunkenly i psoted in a vengeful, angry state.

why did i loose my temper? because to me it seemed like you were sayign the mods and admins owed you something, like Iwaku owed you something.
the case is, Iwaku owes no one anything, apart from Diana and Asmodeus, whos tepped in in our hour of need and helped save the forum.

whilst i agree with you that the postcounts should not be deleted, it was my interpretation of the way you responded that aggrevated me.
that said, the key word there is interpretation so i probably read the wrong kinda spin into it.

i do tht i real life too........its a pain in the arse.
 
X

Xindaris

Guest
See, WMD, I'm not speaking entirely for myself. That seems to be where your interpretation's biggest flaw is. I'm speaking up for the rights of all members of Iwaku, and the fact is, Iwaku wouldn't really even exist without us regular members. So it does owe us something--its existence. Which isn't to say that members get nothing out of it; it's a two-way flow, or folks wouldn't be around for long.

And there is a vote of sorts. If members did not like the admins and mods, guess what? They'd leave. The number of members on Iwaku can be taken as a vote for the structure and administration that is presently in place. And consequently, if things change in a sufficiently unfavorable way, that vote will be taken away--the people will leave. I don't mean that this particular issue is of anywhere near that degree of intensity, no matter which side gives the most votes, but I feel the need to assert the rights of members because I seem to be the only one who feels the need to do so with fair consistency. This all starts from back when Iwaku was going to limit the number of roleplays and all that--THAT was a very high-intensity issue.

In other words, I feel it is the responsibility of members to speak up when they feel things aren't going the way they ought, so I exercise that as a way of giving example. If there were some change I liked that other people didn't, I would sincerely hope that the members who didn't like said change would voice their opinions as I do mine.

My point is that Iwaku doesn't exist just for Asmodeus, Diana, and Rory, and it doesn't exist just for the mods, either. It exists for all members equally, and the power that some members (including the admins) have does not make Iwaku any more theirs than it is everybody else's. The ONLY members who Iwaku might belong a LITTLE less to are the extremely new ones, like less than a month of membership, and those who have renounced their membership to Iwaku altogether.

The final word: Iwaku is not a dictatorship at all in my book--"benevolent" or not--because having moderator rights does not in any way increase the validity of one's opinion about what is better for other roleplayers. I do appreciate all that the admins and mods do for Iwaku, but that doesn't mean they can be irresponsible. Not every little thing should be voted on, but big things should not be done arbitrarily either, and it's the members' responsibility to speak up when they feel big changes are being made without their consent.



--And I know, this whole post is a little off-topic and over-hyped for such a minor change. But I felt the need to make my position clear...
It's also kinda funny that Orochi was apparently joking but it still lead to this kind of argument.
 
W

Warmaster Death

Guest
Just remember that its the staff that do the work.
they roild and work, while we common members just fuck about and have a merry old time.

and speaking up is one thing, but always remember that the forum doesnt owe you its existence, it CAN go on without you (or me, or anyone for that matter).
(all the forum needs to exist is one person. all but one person could go, and so long as one person, be they staff or member, so long as one person bears the torch, Iwaku lives)


so whilst technically Iwaku owes its existence the membership in its entirety, apart from diana and asmo, it really owes no one individual anything.

just so what i'm trying to say is 100% clear:

Iwaku owes the Collective, but it does not owe the individual.


Furthermore the Staff ARE entitled to more than regular members, because they not only INHABIT the forum, the ACTIVELY WORK to better it.
 
X

Xindaris

Guest
See, you make an assumption that's wrong: That is, that members do not, and implicitly CANnot, do anything to better the forum. But every one of us betters the forum by being here and being active. And one of my rather strong assertions is that I should not have to be a mod to help this forum, or be involved in its decisions.

And you can't tell me that members put no work into this site. Sure, maybe members who do nothing but post in insanity contribute very little, but the rest of us work pretty hard to come up with RPs, write up posts, and even argue about members' rights. It may be enjoyable work, but it's still work. It requires mental facilities and effort.

But it is literally impossible to really be a member of a forum and simply "inhabit" it. A forum isn't like a lounge room; you can't just sit down on a couch and ignore everybody, and it's not a crowded dining hall where everybody can be expected to ignore you if you leave them alone. Every single action on a forum is expressed as a post that everyone else can easily read and re-read, and can (and often does) respond to.

And if you get to thinking that Iwaku can live without any single member, be very, very careful. At what point does a mountain of sand cease to be a mountain? Every single grain that is taken out makes it less of one, until it's hill, a mound, and finally just one puny grain. And I'd dare say that even Isabella is worth more than a grain of sand here. A forum with the number of members that our moderators and admins here at Iwaku make up, even if all of said members are interesting, nice people, is a pretty desolate place.

And individual members do have value. A LOT of it. Iwaku is a community, and a community suffers from the loss of even one good member. The removal of even one person is felt by at least three or four, usually far more. You remember when Asmodeus was considering leaving? How many people wanted him not to, or wished him well, or both? I would daresay that as many people are affected when ANY truly active member leaves, but it's not necessarily as easy to see because everybody who leaves isn't Asmodeus. I'm sure I'm not the only one who'll miss Fluffy, for instance.
 
W

Warmaster Death

Guest
Iwaku is an Ideal.so long as one person remembers adn cares for that ideal, it lives.
Iwaku as we know it is indeed made up of all the members present and they DO better the site by simpky being, even the ones that jsut post.

by the way, dont for a single solitary fucking second think i dont miss fluffy.
I miss her as much as i miss having Denku, Bowiegranap, Imperial Edgecrusher, Gabriel Zero, Necella and all the other great members that are no longer on the site.
to be honest, I dont want anyone to leave and i want everyone that did to come back.


but does the site survive? yes, yes it does. it may not survive as well, it may not survive as it once was, but it survives.

and i didnt mean that members dont put effort into their posts, but who organises everything? makes events? ensures the site tuns smoothly and more?
The Staff.


like ive said over and over, members are important, but that doesnt mean we can jump up and down adn demand things of the staff who do what they do ot of the kindness of their hearts.
 
X

Xindaris

Guest
I'm not saying members should make unreasonable demands--the biggest thing I've ever asked for personally was a reversal of a change, a change which would not have been implemented (and thus would have required LESS work) had it been seriously considered and put up for a vote beforehand. I'm saying that members should always be informed and have a say in the way things are done around here, especially major changes, because we are the ones affected. My point is that members may have some good ideas that mods don't, needs and wants that mods are not aware of if unspoken. If members are not allowed to say anything, or feel like they shouldn't or like it won't have any effect, all of that gets lost and people end up dissatisfied, and start leaving in droves.

I must assert that Iwaku is the name of this forum, and a forum is a community; ergo, Iwaku is a community. Perhaps there is an ideal named "Iwaku", but that isn't what I've been discussing this whole time. Besides, an ideal has definition, goals which make it up, and if I understand things correctly, the ideal of Iwaku does involve or require a community. And that integral part of the ideal will never be realized if those members who are working for it are treated as unimportant; at best it would be realized somewhere else.


But I've said my piece, and taken up a bit too much off-topic postage here. If you've more to say perhaps we could take it to PMs or another topic?
 

Orochi

GET OFF MY LAWN :E
We're talking about post count, karma and our members being wankers. What's wrong with you people!


*tries to psychicly lock the thread, nose bleeds*

Dammit!

*tries to telepathically contact Diana-wuss, sets laptop on fire*
 

Blind Hemingway

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Okay time to lay down the law.

Torsty is right, besides if we had the full rights to do whatever we wanted, members would leave in droves.

I'm going to ask that both of you drop the subject. Although it is a healthy debate between two members, this thread is not about arguing what or who makes up a forum.

This thread is now locked. If you have any concerns, PMing Diana, Asmo, or myself works a lot better. That's why we are here.
 

CoffeeCake

"We wait all night for calls like these."
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  3. Elementary
  4. Intermediate
  5. Adept
  6. Advanced
  7. Prestige
  8. Douche
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Preferred Character Gender
  1. Female
  2. Agender
  3. Primarily Prefer Female
Such a passionate discussion lasting so long without either participant resorting to name-calling makes me feel warm and fuzzy. :)
 
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