NPO - Novel Post Obession

[KuroBuros The Infected]

Okay what is up with the obsession with writing 5+ paragraphs with 20 sentences per post? I get some people have more imagination then me but if I wanted to read a novel well I'd pick up a book. For me writing is something I like to do but my farsightedness and attention prevents me from really writing long posts. Also I like being able to write posts when my partners are online so we really get role playing. Hell, last month ChaosMage and I finished a role play in 2 days.


Honestly can somebody tell me why this a thing? Specially with peoples demand on Minimum 4 paragraphs/post ...

 

[Moogle-Girl]

THIS.

I just don't have the attention span for super long posts. One of the major things that will immediately turn me off from a roleplay is when the GM specifies 4-5 paragraphs plus as a requirement. I don't have time for that crap, and I won't feel motivated to give each post the attention it deserves. Naturally, that in turn kills the quality of my own posts. And correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't such a high minimum length requirement force the participants to crowd their posts with fluff? If you need that much text to get your point across, you're doing it wrong, and if you really have THAT MUCH STUFF happening in a single post, ALL THE TIME, that can't possibly be constructive to the whole "group participation" thing.

I'm totally fine with the occasional large post, especially the introductory one for each person's character. But to have such a length be a requirement? I just find that irritating.

 

[Diana]

I think it all comes down to the type of roleplayer they are. O____O The people who write really really long posts, are primarily Descriptive Writers at heart and roleplay for them is just a way to exercise and practice their descriptive skills.

And then you'll get people like me who prefer writing REALLY short posts in quick succession. I am a immersive roleplayer who likes to live/feel the scene i'm in. 8D

And you'll have Puppetmaster Roleplayers that don't really like playing characters, but love building a world around the other players. O__O


I think so of the beeest roleplay groups mix and match the styles of players!

 

[Adelaide]

I'm totally fine with the occasional large post, especially the introductory one for each person's character. But to have such a length be a requirement? I just find that irritating.

Well see the neat thing about this is that they make it really clear what they expect. Requirements are pretty cut and dry so you know what you are getting into. That way if you don't want to be bothered, you don't have to RP with them. Easy.

I am prone to writing long posts, though not epically long, my sweet spot is about 600-700 words though I do often get up into the thousand mark when the scene calls for it or I am dealing with multiple characters. I make it clear so my partner (or group) and I are all on the same page and all are happy with the expectations.

I also do my level best to never make public remarks about people whose tastes differ from mine. Asking for what you like isn't irritating, it is clear-cut and responsible. My preferences aren't better, just different. Rather than gripe about people being clear about what they want and avoiding wasted time and RPing, I look for people who match my length and speed.

 

[KuroBuros The Infected]

I think it all comes down to the type of roleplayer they are. O____O The people who write really really long posts, are primarily Descriptive Writers at heart and roleplay for them is just a way to exercise and practice their descriptive skills.

And then you'll get people like me who prefer writing REALLY short posts in quick succession. I am a immersive roleplayer who likes to live/feel the scene i'm in. 8D

And you'll have Puppetmaster Roleplayers that don't really like playing characters, but love building a world around the other players. O__O


I think so of the beeest roleplay groups mix and match the styles of players!

Im totally fine with people being description based writers but I've been dropped BECAUSE I dont write that long of posts even though I put in my rules I write 1-2 paragraphs unless I get overly creative.

 

[Diana]

That's because those people write a lot but don't know how to read. 8D

 

[KuroBuros The Infected]

That's because those people write a lot but don't know how to read. 8D

Ain't that the truth. But I wish people could really be adaptable in their writing because I'm really tired of sifting through partner searches to find out every one wants novelists instead of rpers.

 

[Adelaide]

Ain't that the truth. But I wish people could really be adaptable in their writing because I'm really tired of sifting through partner searches to find out every one wants novelists instead of rpers.

So I guess I'm on the wrong sort of site then. I thought I was a RPer but apparently I am not??? Who knew I was doing it wrong.

*deep breath* If you don't like the partner searches you are finding, make your own. And be clear you are looking for -real- RPers, not us novelists.

 

[Muirgen]

*taps chin thoughtfully*

I do believe I resemble some of these remarks - my last post was about 1800 words or so...

But never, not once, have I mocked someone else publicly for their personal preference on an RP style. Most of my partners happen to like longer posts, unless of course we need quick action or dialogue in our story (and that's how I personally think of RPs - as stories we co-create). And most of them give as good as they get from me.

I personally have not had the time for uninterrupted IM/chat-style RP in years, not between work and school and family. I don't resent people who do enjoy that - it can be lots of fun. But as my life is now, nine times out of ten I have to stop and start a thousand times before the end of a single full post, between texts and phone calls and e-mails to answer, proverbial "fires to put out" around the house and... Well you get the idea.

I am also up front with the expectations I have of those I write with, about the time I have and what I expect in return. That's not "not being adaptable," it's a courtesy that doesn't waste the time of someone who won't be compatible with my RP style, and makes the most of what time I have to indulge in a hobby I enjoy.

 

[KuroBuros The Infected]

So I guess I'm on the wrong sort of site then. I thought I was a RPer but apparently I am not??? Who knew I was doing it wrong.

*deep breath* If you don't like the partner searches you are finding, make your own. And be clear you are looking for -real- RPers, not us novelists.

You sound offended, I apologize if I have. I have made partner searches making it clear what I want yet some people instill their expectations with out thinking bout talking it out with me, and I get kicked to the curb without any explanation. If you have different expectations then tell me, it's not fair to me to drop me and my rp without attempting to work it out.

 

[KuroBuros The Infected]

*taps chin thoughtfully*

I do believe I resemble some of these remarks - my last post was about 1800 words or so...

But never, not once, have I mocked someone else publicly for their personal preference on an RP style. Most of my partners happen to like longer posts, unless of course we need quick action or dialogue in our story (and that's how I personally think of RPs - as stories we co-create). And most of them give as good as they get from me.

I personally have not had the time for uninterrupted IM/chat-style RP in years, not between work and school and family. I don't resent people who do enjoy that - it can be lots of fun. But as my life is now, nine times out of ten I have to stop and start a thousand times before the end of a single full post, between texts and phone calls and e-mails to answer, proverbial "fires to put out" around the house and... Well you get the idea.

I am also up front with the expectations I have of those I write with, about the time I have and what I expect in return. That's not "not being adaptable," it's a courtesy that doesn't waste the time of someone who won't be compatible with my RP style, and makes the most of what time I have to indulge in a hobby I enjoy.

I'm in no way mocking your style of writing. I'm really sorry if it sounds that way.

 

[Adelaide]

I'm in no way mocking your style of writing. I'm really sorry if it sounds that way.

Ain't that the truth. But I wish people could really be adaptable in their writing because I'm really tired of sifting through partner searches to find out every one wants novelists instead of rpers.

I think if you look at the bolded text you will see what the issue is (which I found because despite the implications otherwise, I read even though I write long posts). You said that people who write more than you like to aren't RPers. I would never ever imply that someone who likes to write less than I isn't a RPer, they are. I am. We just like to do it differently.

 

[KuroBuros The Infected]

I think if you look at the bolded text you will see what the issue is (which I found because despite the implications otherwise, I read even though I write long posts). You said that people who write more than you like to aren't RPers. I would never ever imply that someone who likes to write less than I isn't a RPer, they are. I am. We just like to do it differently.

I'm sorry if you took offense to my reply to Diana's joke, but I never was attempting to mock other rp styles of writing. I have apologized to you for the remark and it was never meant to be malicious. It was a joke following the fact that I had mentioned before that I have specific requirements that rpers that do write these replies have started role plays have contacted me on my searches and then drop me because they suddenly realize that I post much less then their expectation even after I list on my search what I post regularly.

 

[Moogle-Girl]

Well see the neat thing about this is that they make it really clear what they expect. Requirements are pretty cut and dry so you know what you are getting into. That way if you don't want to be bothered, you don't have to RP with them. Easy.

The problem with filtering people based on post length is what Diana talked about -- there are many different types of RPers. By using post length as a requirement you're immediately shutting out people who may be just as good at things like character development or scenery, but can't write quality long posts. That just rubs me the wrong way.

I want to be clear that I don't have any problem with individual people who write long posts! As long as you can avoid pages of needless fluff then whatever floats your boat. My beef is with people who make this sort of thing a requirement for anyone entering their RPs. The implication I carry away is that I'm not "good enough" because I don't have that type of style. Doesn't help that most GMs I've encountered who required long posts were a little snooty about it, implying that posts of shorter length weren't "good quality" or whatever.

Maybe I'm just reading too much into things...

 

[Kagayours]

Also I like being able to write posts when my partners are online so we really get role playing.

And see, there's the thing.

You're the type of RPer who likes quick back-and-forth. You like to be online at the same time as your partner so you two can keep things flowing quickly. And if that's the case, it makes perfect sense that you wouldn't like long posts. Long posts sort of inevitably means slower replies.

But, not all RPers like that speed. Me? I just don't have the stamina, nor the on-the-spot thinking as much. I generally don't reply to things right away. I wait till a good time to sit down and do it, and I tend to only post a few times a week. That said, when I do go to write a post, I tend to make it more descriptive -- because, when I'm not necessarily online at the same time as my group-mates and I'm not expecting a fast reply, nor are they expecting a fast reply from me, I have more time to really get into it and have more fun writing a single post. In particular, I tend to spend a lot of time focusing on my character's thoughts and emotions and what influences their actions, and I tend to get a teensy bit artsy in my descriptions, as well, because that's more of the fun thing to do in a sit-down-and-write-a-post kind of mindset, as opposed to a stay-online-and-keep-going-back-and-forth sort of thing, at least for me.

However, I'm generally not a fan of length requirements, not just because A) I'm not expecting my group-mates to write a ton with every single post, and B) I don't write a ton with every post, either. Yeah, there are some posts where I feel there's a lot more that should be said and there's more to react to, so I'll write a good 3-4 paragraph post. Maybe I'll just happen to write several replies in a row that are about that length. But not every post is like that. Sometimes there's just less to say, and I'll write a post that's only one paragraph. And there's nothing wrong with that. A shorter post is never really "lower quality" to me, it just is. The only time when a short post doesn't cut it is when the player provides no new action for others to react to, and that's a problem of a completely different nature which, although it seems to appear more often in shorter posts, can theoretically plague longer posts, too.

That's why I never try to fluff up my posts for length's sake alone, and I try to make it clear to my fellow RPers that there's no need for them to do that, either. I get a lot of players in my RP's apologizing for short posts, and me repeatedly telling them that there's really no need to apologize. And, often, I feel like I can tell when they're trying to fluff up their posts to make them longer -- not just because these are usually the same people who apologize for short posts, but also because it seems like you can just sort of tell when someone adds details to a post just to make it longer, and not because they wanted to. I don't know, it seems like there's just a different feel between detailed descriptions that exist because the RPer wanted them to be there and that flow alright with the rest of the post and detailed descriptions that just seem superfluous, like they were only added to take up space. And that's why I don't give people length requirements -- I don't want to do that to my posts and I don't want anyone else to feel like they have to. If the posts in one of my RP's just so happen to turn out rather long then that's just how things go, but no one's required to continuously hit that length if it doesn't feel right in a given scenario.

So yeah, it's not really about hitting a specific length, at least in my case. It's just that a more descriptive style makes more sense with slower-paced RP's, so those posts tend to be longer.

 

[KuroBuros The Infected]

And see, there's the thing.

You're the type of RPer who likes quick back-and-forth. You like to be online at the same time as your partner so you two can keep things flowing quickly. And if that's the case, it makes perfect sense that you wouldn't like long posts. Long posts sort of inevitably means slower replies.

But, not all RPers like that speed. Me? I just don't have the stamina, nor the on-the-spot thinking as much. I generally don't reply to things right away. I wait till a good time to sit down and do it, and I tend to only post a few times a week. That said, when I do go to write a post, I tend to make it more descriptive -- because, when I'm not necessarily online at the same time as my group-mates and I'm not expecting a fast reply, nor are they expecting a fast reply from me, I have more time to really get into it and have more fun writing a single post. In particular, I tend to spend a lot of time focusing on my character's thoughts and emotions and what influences their actions, and I tend to get a teensy bit artsy in my descriptions, as well, because that's more of the fun thing to do in a sit-down-and-write-a-post kind of mindset, as opposed to a stay-online-and-keep-going-back-and-forth sort of thing, at least for me.

However, I'm generally not a fan of length requirements, not just because A) I'm not expecting my group-mates to write a ton with every single post, and B) I don't write a ton with every post, either. Yeah, there are some posts where I feel there's a lot more that should be said and there's more to react to, so I'll write a good 3-4 paragraph post. Maybe I'll just happen to write several replies in a row that are about that length. But not every post is like that. Sometimes there's just less to say, and I'll write a post that's only one paragraph. And there's nothing wrong with that. A shorter post is never really "lower quality" to me, it just is. The only time when a short post doesn't cut it is when the player provides no new action for others to react to, and that's a problem of a completely different nature which, although it seems to appear more often in shorter posts, can theoretically plague longer posts, too.

That's why I never try to fluff up my posts for length's sake alone, and I try to make it clear to my fellow RPers that there's no need for them to do that, either. I get a lot of players in my RP's apologizing for short posts, and me repeatedly telling them that there's really no need to apologize. And, often, I feel like I can tell when they're trying to fluff up their posts to make them longer -- not just because these are usually the same people who apologize for short posts, but also because it seems like you can just sort of tell when someone adds details to a post just to make it longer, and not because they wanted to. I don't know, it seems like there's just a different feel between detailed descriptions that exist because the RPer wanted them to be there and that flow alright with the rest of the post and detailed descriptions that just seem superfluous, like they were only added to take up space. And that's why I don't give people length requirements -- I don't want to do that to my posts and I don't want anyone else to feel like they have to. If the posts in one of my RP's just so happen to turn out rather long then that's just how things go, but no one's required to continuously hit that length if it doesn't feel right in a given scenario.

So yeah, it's not really about hitting a specific length, at least in my case. It's just that a more descriptive style makes more sense with slower-paced RP's, so those posts tend to be longer.

I wish that I could write 4+ paragraphs but I can't do to medical reasons, but I get where you are getting at and I thank you for explaining your reasoning as a longer post writer.

 

[Grif ♥]

Four to five paragraphs doesn't seem unreasonable to me. Everyone has their personal tastes though, and the length of a post means nothing if there's literally no useful content in it (as nice as it is to hear about what your character thinks about the weather this evening, it honestly doesn't progress the roleplay all too much), so I can understand others finding that too long. Different strokes for different folks, after all.

I like slow roleplays where I can spend a lot of time thinking about my character, and about the situation they're in, and longer posts typically suit that kind of roleplaying. I'm also lazy as hell so it means I can slack off for a while and pick it up later without dragging the roleplay behind.

 

[Brovo]

The problem is less with long posts and more with badly written long posts. If you have six paragraphs detailing multiple protagonists dealing with several simultaneous actions, and expand upon physical circumstances or behaviours which others can perceive and react to, it's probably a solid post. If you're going into grotesquely superficial and obtuse detail involving six paragraphs describing how a bush moved in the wind, or six paragraphs about your character angsting to the sound of Linkin Park in the background... It's probably terrible writing.

I've written two guides about this kind of subject matter. One dealing with writing specifically, and another dealing with content relevancy for players around you. This is generally why I say that PBPRP and writing a novel are not one and the same: Good character exposition in a novel is generally an entirely shit way of conveying progression or emotion in a role play. They have similar skill sets that can carry over, but no more so than is the norm for other genre crossovers: Like novel to play writing, or novel to script writing for film, or novel to writing for a video game, et cetera. Basic principles are the same, how you use them in practice is very different.

In short: Good long posts in a role play involve lots of actions which others can react to, the progression of scenes through physical means, and behaviours or emotions conveyed through expressions and body language. Bad long posts involve describing with excessive detail objects or scenery which everyone is already aware exists, and more inner monologue than a terribly written anime or harlequin romance novel. Golden rule is quite simple: If the sentence you just wrote adds nothing to the scene, cut that sentence. It may hurt in the short term, but it will cure shitty writing habits. Trust me, do I look like a man who would lie to you?

 

[Midian]

I think @Brovo has written an excellent post, and I agree. Posts ultimately should be about content, not length. A good post should have your character interacting with the environment/situation and other players both physically and mentally. We want your character to do something while also getting a better understanding of them through seeing both the physical and psychological changes; at least, I imagine most people do. It's what give characters depth and life.

Some people can accomplish that succinctly, others need a few paragraphs to do that. And so I'm about to say this next bit through the perspective of someone who's taught college/uni writing and assigned her fair share of papers with page number requirements (and who does have length requirements for partners and roleplayers).

I always have to tell my students: I've assigned this number of pages because at anything shorter you are probably not covering the content as thoroughly as I want you to. This is my logic behind having posting requirements, although I don't require 3-4 large paragraphs (I do, however, love them); I typically ask for 2 or so well-developed paragraphs because I enjoy seeing other people's characters think, reflect, and interact with others and the environment, and the amount I like to see generally can't be done in a few sentences or a short paragraph.

Choosing players who will write much longer posts increases the chances they'll at least accidentally give me some really juicy character development, in other words. This isn't to say shorter posts can't, but I've found it to be much less frequent. And personally, I become disinterested really quickly in an RP when posts are consistently short; I'm just not getting all the content I want. At least not for forum-style roleplays. I also enjoy real-time chat RPs, and naturally I don't want paragraphs in that medium.

So ultimately, I think it boils down to what GMs and partners need from their players. Some people don't want to read long posts, some love them. It's all about compatibility :)

 

[the crafty pig]

I think bravo has hit the nail on the hid really, it is quality not quantity and I probably stray on the side of quantity too often but hey ho.

Personally as a "novelist" writer the reason I write longer posts is because this is my sole outlet for the small amount of creativity I have. I love writing but I'm sad to say I don't have the commitment or the imagination to write my own novel or short story. Here I get a forum to share my writing and also live out some incredible scenarios all with direction of how to proceed.

For that reason I put effort into my posts and use a fair bit of desciption to really set a scene. I love to explore thoughts and feelings and pour through my characters emotions. I can understand why it would frustrate quicker posters and for that reason I personally try and make it clear that I am a one post a week guy and stick away from 1 v 1 rps as it can be very frustration waiting on a guy for ages when all you want to do is move on the story.

I think also some smaller posters get frustrated as longer posters make them feel they have to do more to keep up. Personally I always say in any of my rps that I gm that I am looking for advanced level but within that for them to be the best they can be. I would never criticise someone for doing one or two paragraphs if it was good content or needed to advance the story.