Doctor's Visits/Pharmacuticals, or Folk Medicine/Alternative Healing?

[Minibit]

/disappoint at lack of poll

Both. "Real" meds if it's a dangerous thing, a necessity that nature can't provide and/or needs to be fixed fast. Herbals/natural treatment if not

A cold? Headache? wacky sleep schedule? myofasial syndrome acting up?
I drink teas (ginger usually) stretch, rest, and make sure I'm eating and hydrating properly. With headaches and insomnia, I also get away from screens. I have a relative who teaches fitness too so she can usually recommend stretches if they're needed, and make sure I'm doing them right.

But allergic reaction, migraines, intense and prolonged pain, birth control, or anything that makes me unable to work at all, I talk to a doctor or pharmacist and get a targeted medication and advice on natural remedies I can supplement with. My doctor understands that I want my body to fight for itself and not become dependant on drugs, as well as that my liver and kidneys are already not perfect because of years of varying pain medication and I'd rather not ruin them further.

 

[Marchosias]

Lol sory for not including a poll, didnt see a need for it since its just 2 options basicly.

My doctor understands that I want my body to fight for itself and not become dependant on drugs, as well as that my liver and kidneys are already not perfect because of years of varying pain medication and I'd rather not ruin them further.

Smart. The less drugs you put in your system, the better. If your liver and kidneys are already afected, it may be too late by now... But at least you can prevent any more damage, true.

 

[Dervish]

Considering we aren't all dying of plagues, flus, measels, small pox, scurvy, and countless other ailments on a regular basis, I'm inclined to put more faith in people with doctorates than some crazy person who lives out of a Volkswagen van that's fuming incense like a shitty German-made hippy dragon.

Show me the journals and studies outlining a medicine's purposes, potential side effects, and effectiveness and I will accept it as medicine. The vast majority of "natural" or "alternative" medicines are oftentimes scams, don't work, and are meant to swindle people who have been told not to trust doctors out of their money. Shitty celebrities are the primary culprits of this.

I also don't buy into the "I don't want chemicals in my body" argument because literally everything you ingest is a chemical, and as far as your body is concerned, it doesn't matter if it's natural or synthetic as long as all the compounds are in place. There's a term toxicologists use, the dose makes the poison. Literally everything can be poisonous to your body, it just matters how much you intake. Water, for instance, is something people have overdosed on. LSD, so far, hasn't had a lethal dose discovered and it's a lab made chemical compound.

I've been on a pharmacy's worth of various medications for my personal health troubles, and while I hated every single one of them, it's sure as hell better than potentially having my intestine removed because it's too damaged to function. I would rather trust a doctor's professional opinion over someone who runs a niche alternative health store. If you want to talk vested interests, there you go.

 

[Seba]

Had I been born in almost any other time I would be dead due to a variety of issues that I just have. Can't get rid of them. I'm in full favor of better living through chemistry.

I like some folk remedies, but only after they have been recommended by a doctor. At that point I don't call it a folk remedy, it's just not sold at a pharmacy. Still medicine, it just doesn't look like medicine. Backed by science, makes me happy.

My immune system is terrible and my upper respiratory is worse. I don't like having to take time out of my day to schedule a visit, but I also enjoy being able to breathe somewhat well and go to class/work. Doctors have spent about a decade learning how to put people back together, so I'd trust them over anything else.

 

[Marchosias]

it doesn't matter if it's natural or synthetic as long as all the compounds are in place.

Oh it matters... not in the short term, but the long term... it matters very much.

Water, for instance, is something people have overdosed on.

:P Thats the best joke I heard this month! I drink about 4 liters of water per day. How come I'm not a water-junkie?

 

[Dervish]

Oh it matters... not in the short term, but the long term... it matters very much.


:P Thats the best joke I heard this month! I drink about 4 liters of water per day. How come I'm not a water-junkie?

yup. Hilarious.

And no, if a chemical compound is the same, it does not matter how it's made. A carbon molecule is a carbon molecule, after all.

 

[Marchosias]

yup. Hilarious.

And no, if a chemical compound is the same, it does not matter how it's made. A carbon molecule is a carbon molecule, after all.

Hilarious indeed... Thats the first time I heard of that so-caled water-intoxication "disease". And directly at-odds vith everything I ever learned about the efects on water on the body. And if it were true... I shuld have it, I guess, since I drink 2 times the "recomended" water dosage. I dont have it, never had those symptoms. And as for that other disease, that one only applys to people vith liver problems. So it dont count. If your organs arent healthy, yes, anything can be dangerous to consume.

Water cleanses the body, and maintains the flow of inner energy. The more you drink it, the more beneficial the efects get. Thats the rule I alvays lived by, and it hasnt failed me yet.

***

It matters. If it belongs in the body in the first place, or dont. If it does, fine. If not - not good. And most medicines are made vith certain ingredients that do not belong in the body. Hence - unnatural, and potentialy damaging. Why else does 99.9% of pharmacuticals always have negative side-efects listed? Because they compromise: improve one condition, at the expense of some other condition vorsening. And I bet you that most of the more adverse side-efects arent even listed, in a effort to promote the "wonder drug" of the month. How many meds get pulled-off the market each year? And those only that are actualy discovered as damaging. How many more go un-discovered?

Read this and weep...

 

[Hecatoncheires]

"PERSON WHO HAS SPENT MOST OF THEIR ADULT LIFE RIGOUROUSLY STUDYING THING VS RANDOM GOBSHITE ON INTERNET WHO THINKS THAT THING CAN BE SOLVED BY BLEACH ENEMAS"

Gee, I wonder who to believe.

 

[Dervish]

Just because you don't know something doesn't mean it's not true. It tends to be how science works. Its principles hold true whether or not you believe in them, especially when there's data to back it up.

Anyways, I gave my opinion. That's all I have to say on the matter, other than don't discourage people from seeking professional medical help because you have an irrational grudge against modern medicine. It's potentially dangerous and irresponsible if someone needs medicine or other treatments and they're told it's poison. Never underestimate the sway one's words can have.

 

[Marchosias]

Just because you don't know something doesn't mean it's not true. It tends to be how science works. Its principles hold true whether or not you believe in them, especially when there's data to back it up.

Anyways, I gave my opinion. That's all I have to say on the matter, other than don't discourage people from seeking professional medical help because you have an irrational grudge against modern medicine. It's potentially dangerous and irresponsible if someone needs medicine or other treatments and they're told it's poison. Never underestimate the sway one's words can have.

Irrational grudge? I take it you havent looked at my link? The grudge is VERY rational indeed. Science is all wel and good, but vhen its skewed by corporate greed, it no longer is a viable option. If someone borders on irresponsible, its you for your blind faith in chemicals.

My opinion.

 

[Marchosias]

Aniway, heres another link ppl might find iluminating. Alternative medicine isnt just a side-efect free superior alternative to poisoning ones body vith chemicals, its also a introduction in-to a healthyer way of life.

 

[Icystorm]

Doctors and Medicine. If it is something little then there is no point in going (no point in wasting money when you don't need to). I say doctors because normally I end up needing to go to a specialist because I have something that is not normal. Tourettes (took medicine at first since they were so bad, but the side effects for the meds that treated it all sucked so now I don't take any, especially since they are under control now) and then had three spinal fusions..needed pain meds after those surgeries, and even with the pain meds it hurt like hell. Although after the latest one a giant cockroach crawled into the hospital room after I sat up to eat. Yeah, if that thing had decided to start flying I would have become mobile pretty fast and made it to the bathroom in record time.

Although I do have a question @Marchosias
Know anything good for dry feet? The lotion that works is expensive, and I don't want my feet to look like my dad's ;_;

 

[Brovo]

Aniway, heres another link ppl might find iluminating. Alternative medicine isnt just a side-efect free superior alternative to poisoning ones body vith chemicals, its also a introduction in-to a healthyer way of life.

Heartburn drugs are a $15 billion a year industry in North America, mainly because it's far more profitable to steer people to drugs than to healthier diets, stress reduction or herbal remedies like slippery elm, ginger, digestive enzymes and deglycyrrhizinated licorice root lozenges (DGL).

Um. Are they high? There is a constant push by the medical industry in every first world country on Earth to try and get people to adopt healthier diets and some form of physical exercising routine. One of the very first things a doctor recommends when you have a clear and obvious imbalance in your diet is to change your diet, not take a billion drugs. Remember this? There's like a dozen variations on it, all produced by the medical industry, all telling you to stop being a sugar-consuming fat fuck. Anyway, alternative medicine vs real medicine...

1. Real medicine uses science and clearly tells you what the side effects are because they don't try to sell magical cure-alls. They sell things which can help balance a body which is in turmoil. Alternative medicines, on the other hand, lie to you blatantly, and pretend to be magical cure-alls. They don't list any side effects because they're either placebos--IE, they have no medicinal benefit anywhere within the ingredients list--or they're blatantly lying to you to turn a profit off your ignorance and fear of scientific progress.
2. Real medicine is forced through several years of drug trials. If it, in any way, shape, or form, causes detriment to human life, it must be listed as a side effect. If it fails in any way, shape, or form, to do as it advertises, you have to start all over again and pour millions of dollars more and thousands of man hours more into figuring out why it's not working. That's why medicine is one of the most expensive industries on Earth: Because they go through so many precautions, that no other industry has to go through. Not even your food production is put through such rigorous testing. Meanwhile, alternative medicine has no testing beyond "we swear it's real guiz". As a result, there has been 368,379 people killed, 306,096 injured and over $2,815,931,000 in economic damages. And that's only when someone bothered to even start counting it, god knows how many perished in the medieval era because of insane, deranged "medicine" plans.
3. If alternative medicine was actually nearly as effective as real medicine, then please explain how the medieval era is renowned across the world as a period with the most devastating plagues ever conceived by mankind? Why the infant mortality rate was so obscenely high? Why maternal death rates by birth was so absurdly high? Explain how a world without real medicine is superior, when we have mountains of historical evidence of what that world looks like--the medieval era.

That's just three points off the top of my head. Don't even get me started on how most of them require "faith" as a goddamn ingredient. Don't even get me started on the stupidity of anti-vaccine nuts, who are a core market demographic of alternative medicines. Don't even get me started on how deranged and childish it is to sincerely believe that organizations composed of tens of thousands of people (leave alone the sheer number of medical scientists), would for some reason not only be able to lie to you about all medicines, but lie to you on a scale that would require hundreds of thousands of people to all agree to the lie, in favour of... A conman with no medical degree selling you a magical cure-all that originally came from voodoo practices, back in an era where people cured repeated sneezing by drilling a hole in your head.

Look, you can take all the alternative medicine enemas you want and fool yourself into believing it's doing anything when your body is doing all the work, all day. I don't care. Just don't go about telling people that alternative medicine is somehow superior to real medicine because it blatantly lies to you and contains no verifiable method of actually doing anything useful. This attempt to proselytize others into the church of "natural" medicines is beyond damaging. Without medicine, without trained doctors, I would not be alive today. Even if I was, I would most certainly be a cripple, hunched over, and barely functioning. Telling me all those people are just trying to profit off of my misery, compared to the alternative medicine industry--which specifically profits off of those who are paranoid and miserable--is obscene to me. If you fool even one person into going for alternative medicine instead of a real, actual doctor, and they suffer long term damage for it, in my mind, you should be held criminally liable for medical malpractice.

Unfortunately, that's not how my country works.

So I'm just going to have to deal with the fact that your response will be more pseudo-science voodoo nonsense about how big pharma is satan incarnate, and how people practicing ancient chinese medicine that has been proven to do fuck all are somehow superior. That magic is superior to science, for no credible evidence than "muh personal experiences".

So, go right ahead. I'll be here, chuckling darkly, when I get to see you folks be responsible for the rise of the next black plague, because your insane paranoia causes you to trust street peddlers over university-educated scientists and doctors.

 

[Marchosias]

Although I do have a question @Marchosias
Know anything good for dry feet? The lotion that works is expensive, and I don't want my feet to look like my dad's ;_;

Dry feet? As in... leathery, rough, etc? I get those sometimes after a session in a solarium. For some reason the skin on my feet dont like all that UV bombardment. XD But I like tanning, so... aniway, I just rub in some olive-oil (preferably virgin olive oil, a litle more expensive but worth it), and let it sink-in-to the skin. Ofc be sure not to put on socks or shoes until the oil is dryed off, unles you want nasty oil-stains on them to wash up later.

 

[Peter Feels]

I've read no one's opinion and I care little for them. I think you could and maybe should use both if they work for you. Or not, I'm not your mom.

I will not accept arguments about any of this because fuck you.

 

[Marchosias]

Um. Are they high? There is a constant push by the medical industry in every first world country on Earth to try and get people to adopt healthier diets and some form of physical exercising routine. One of the very first things a doctor recommends when you have a clear and obvious imbalance in your diet is to change your diet, not take a billion drugs. Remember this? There's like a dozen variations on it, all produced by the medical industry, all telling you to stop being a sugar-consuming fat fuck. Anyway, alternative medicine vs real medicine...

1. Real medicine uses science and clearly tells you what the side effects are because they don't try to sell magical cure-alls. They sell things which can help balance a body which is in turmoil. Alternative medicines, on the other hand, lie to you blatantly, and pretend to be magical cure-alls. They don't list any side effects because they're either placebos--IE, they have no medicinal benefit anywhere within the ingredients list--or they're blatantly lying to you to turn a profit off your ignorance and fear of scientific progress.
2. Real medicine is forced through several years of drug trials. If it, in any way, shape, or form, causes detriment to human life, it must be listed as a side effect. If it fails in any way, shape, or form, to do as it advertises, you have to start all over again and pour millions of dollars more and thousands of man hours more into figuring out why it's not working. That's why medicine is one of the most expensive industries on Earth: Because they go through so many precautions, that no other industry has to go through. Not even your food production is put through such rigorous testing. Meanwhile, alternative medicine has no testing beyond "we swear it's real guiz". As a result, there has been 368,379 people killed, 306,096 injured and over $2,815,931,000 in economic damages. And that's only when someone bothered to even start counting it, god knows how many perished in the medieval era because of insane, deranged "medicine" plans.
3. If alternative medicine was actually nearly as effective as real medicine, then please explain how the medieval era is renowned across the world as a period with the most devastating plagues ever conceived by mankind? Why the infant mortality rate was so obscenely high? Why maternal death rates by birth was so absurdly high? Explain how a world without real medicine is superior, when we have mountains of historical evidence of what that world looks like--the medieval era.

That's just three points off the top of my head. Don't even get me started on how most of them require "faith" as a goddamn ingredient. Don't even get me started on the stupidity of anti-vaccine nuts, who are a core market demographic of alternative medicines. Don't even get me started on how deranged and childish it is to sincerely believe that organizations composed of tens of thousands of people (leave alone the sheer number of medical scientists), would for some reason not only be able to lie to you about all medicines, but lie to you on a scale that would require hundreds of thousands of people to all agree to the lie, in favour of... A conman with no medical degree selling you a magical cure-all that originally came from voodoo practices, back in an era where people cured repeated sneezing by drilling a hole in your head.

Look, you can take all the alternative medicine enemas you want and fool yourself into believing it's doing anything when your body is doing all the work, all day. I don't care. Just don't go about telling people that alternative medicine is somehow superior to real medicine because it blatantly lies to you and contains no verifiable method of actually doing anything useful. This attempt to proselytize others into the church of "natural" medicines is beyond damaging. Without medicine, without trained doctors, I would not be alive today. Even if I was, I would most certainly be a cripple, hunched over, and barely functioning. Telling me all those people are just trying to profit off of my misery, compared to the alternative medicine industry--which specifically profits off of those who are paranoid and miserable--is obscene to me. If you fool even one person into going for alternative medicine instead of a real, actual doctor, and they suffer long term damage for it, in my mind, you should be held criminally liable for medical malpractice.

Unfortunately, that's not how my country works.

So I'm just going to have to deal with the fact that your response will be more pseudo-science voodoo nonsense about how big pharma is satan incarnate, and how people practicing ancient chinese medicine that has been proven to do fuck all are somehow superior. That magic is superior to science, for no credible evidence than "muh personal experiences".

So, go right ahead. I'll be here, chuckling darkly, when I get to see you folks be responsible for the rise of the next black plague, because your insane paranoia causes you to trust street peddlers over university-educated scientists and doctors.

No. You know vhat, I know vhen debating someone is useless, and I wont be drawed in-to a argument. You have your view, I have mine, we're both set-in-stone in them, you seem to work fine vith yours (and I congratulate you on that, since I culdnt do that in a milion years), I know I work fine vith mine... so thats that. You seem to be healthy enogh (at least I assume so), and ultimatly thats all that maters no mater how its achived, so... have a nice life. :)

 

[Brovo]

have a nice life. :)

You too. As I said, eat as much alternative medicine as you like. Just don't go encouraging people to take it over trained doctors, because that could legitimately end someone's life if they actually take your advice. Most of the time I'm pretty tongue n' cheek about this stuff, but this is pretty serious, because it can lead to... You know... Dying painfully.

 

[Hecatoncheires]

Did... did people just agree to disagree in a General Chat thread, rather than resort to shit flinging?

IT'S A FUCKING CHRISTMAS MIRACLE.

 

[Marchosias]

You too. As I said, eat as much alternative medicine as you like. Just don't go encouraging people to take it over trained doctors, because that could legitimately end someone's life if they actually take your advice. Most of the time I'm pretty tongue n' cheek about this stuff, but this is pretty serious, because it can lead to... You know... Dying painfully.

And it can just as easyli end someones life if they take some shitty drug vith nasty side-efects, like very graphicly described in my first link. So please dont act all high and mighty, because my hypocrisy-meter is spiking already. Your argument is just as one-sided as mine, if not more so.

And for your information, I give this kind of advice to ppl on a dayli basis in RL. 80% of them thank me for it later. I have seen vhat "real medicine" can do, one of my friends' parents becoming a poisoned-shell of himself, thru Chemotherapy. Lost all hair, lost most of his eye-sight, can barely walk. Yay for chemicals! Alternative medicine is EVERY BIT as legit as "real" one. Just because it isnt as hyped-up and because the corporations have a interest in keeping it on the margins, does not make it false. Period.

 

[Hecatoncheires]

...NEVERMIND.