Dear Iwaku. I come to you with a question.

Discussion in 'THREAD ARCHIVES' started by Ko T'suno, Dec 20, 2014.

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  1. That question is simple. Yet after having an argument about it, I thought to myself. "Who better to ask the the wonderous minds that make up Iwaku." So here it is.


    So it is more then one question my bad.
    Hmm maybe I should give the story behind the question. No?

    Me and a fellow rp'er were talking about Elemental Kenisis or Elemental bending. Which ever one want to call it, and Elemental Magic. With my fellow claiming it still is magic, but when asked about telekenisis they said it was not I right to be confused?

    ~signed~ Ko T'suno..

    P.s. Sorry about the more then one question.
  2. telekinesis is in name not magic but there is magic thats basically the same thing levitation
    hopes this helps
  3. It can be whatever you want it to be. I mean, it's your universe you're gonna put it in. You decide.
  4. How is telekinesis not magic? It is moving stuff with your mind. That doesn't mean you aren't magical.
  5. Telekinesis is generally not a magical ability because it falls in with a number of other types of supernatural abilities (precognition, telepathy, astral projection, aura reading, you can see a complete list here) that are considered a "psychic ability". Psychic abilities differ from magic because psychic abilities are generally considered to come straight from the person wielding them. It is the power of their mind bending the nature of reality. By contrast, be it spirits, gods, incantations, rituals, deals with devils, the list goes on, magic is generally considered to have a more external source. Note: generally There is also the matter that most psychics are born with their abilities, and they may or may not grow stronger with usage, while magic usually has to be learned and trained before people can use it easily and correctly. There is then also qi (chi, ch'i or ki), which is also accepted as a different thing from psionics and magic, if you want to make things very complicated. :)

    That does not mean that magic and psychic abilities cannot have the same result (a pyrokinesis could light a fire, while a mage could use a mild fire spell to achieve the same effect), but they are generally considered different. In most of the original tabletop games, psychic abilities and magical abilities are kept completely separate. Dispel magic and anti-magic shields have no ability to stop psychic abilities and psychic shields likewise doesn’t offer any protection against mind influencing spells.

    That does not mean that you cannot label psychic abilites as magic. It is your universe, and, as Kestrel said, it can ultimately be anything you please. But, if you are going off the traditional beliefs, psychic abilities and magic are different things, with different beliefs behind them, and usually a different purpose behind their use. I could go into a lot more depth if you want me to start getting analytical, but that is a dangerous path to follow. :)
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  6. If we're talking technically: It depends on the context of the universe.

    The rule of magic is thus: That which defies established laws of the natural/scientific world, without sufficient explanation and limits, is essentially magic.

    If you give telekinesis a set of rules and an explanation for how it's possible in your world, then it's not considered magic within the context of your world. Keep in mind however that the more rules you break, the softer your fantasy becomes. (Refer to Moh's Scale for Sci-Fi Hardness as an example.) The more reality-bending powers you have, regardless of whether they are explained as magic or have clearly defined boundaries and rules within nature, the further away from reality your RP will go. The further away from reality it goes, the further the emphasis becomes on "fantasy" rather than "realism", which isn't bad, but it's important to understand this for the basics of world building.

    Note, though, that if your telekinesis "just works" and has no rational explanations for clear boundaries and rules, then yes, it basically is just relabeled magic.
  7. While the discussion of origin and style has been discussed by those before me, I've another aspect to bring to the table: mechanics.

    Kinesis as a word means movement. Its use in telekinesis, for example, essentially means to move at a distance. As such, a pyrokinetic can move fire.

    Magic, on the other hand, goes back to doing the supernatural through some form of ritual. It's a lot more vague. However, it is typically seen—as described by @Peregrine —as drawing from an external source. That can also include internal mana, but the mana itself would exist independently of its carrier.

    What this effectively leads to is that elemental kinetics typically move matter that already exists. A pyrokinetic could expand the fire from her lighter, but not create a flame herself; a geokinetic could throw stones at others, but he would be useless in an airplane. Elementalists, however, use mana to create their element as well as manipulate it. More often will you see a water elementalist shooting torrents from their hands then drawing it from some other source.

    Of course, these mechanical limitations can be freely exchanged and altered at the will of the universe into which their concepts are applied. This is merely the tendency I have observed as being the most common.

    EDIT: The reason the kinetics are therefore rarely considered as using magic is because as mentioned earlier, they merely bend the rules of the world to move existing matter. Elementalists, on the other hand, are creating something from nothing—an ability particular to the concept of magic.
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